An Ubers Sand Team I've been using this team for a while now, and it's proven to be quite successful, getting me to a high ladder ranking as well as getting me quite a few wins against some top players (some of whom include the people ranked above myself). Anyways, my account, Just Messin' Around, was recently hacked because I forgot to put a password on it, so some random person got on my account and made a password. Because of this, and my declining interest in the Uber metagame (I migrate from Ubers to UU to OU and back again frequently), I have decided to somewhat retire this team. I'll play with it every now and then I bet, but I'm focusing more on abusing the overpowered UU Pokémon at the moment like Raikou and Wobuffet <3 Building the Team Alright so I decided that I wanted to use Excadrill in Ubers after realizing how destructive it can be in a tier filled with dragon attacks and physically defensive weak Pokémon. Of course, I needed Tyranitar to help me complete this task, as Excadrill's underwhelming Speed outside of sandstorm makes him not quite up to par with the Uber powerhouses. From here I decided that I needed a couple Pokémon to take care of Kyogre and Groudon that could still allow me to maintain offensive momentum. I decided on mixed Rayquaza and Electric Arceus. The former baits in Groudon and weakens it greatly with Draco Meteor to the point that it cannot come in on Tyranitar anymore. Electric Arceus also baits in Groudon and 2HKOs physically defensive variants with Ice Beam, but more importantly, it poses a great threat to Kyogre. By setting up rocks quickly and double switching to Arceus Electric when Kyogre is expected to come in, it can be held at bay for a good chunk of the match. I decided at this point to patch some obvious synergy problems, for Electric, Dragon/Flying, Steel/Ground, and Dark/Rock share many weaknesses (Ground, Water, Fighting etc.). I threw in Giratina-O because it stops many physical threats such as Blaziken, Extreme Speed Arceus, opposing Excadrill etc. and because it's typing and ability are amazing. I threw in Ferrothorn last as a back up for Kyogre, provided it managed to get in for free, and because it provided a decent check to quite a few other threats. I laddered for about a week or so with this team and reached the mid 1500s with little effort. However, problems with Darkrai, special variants of Arceus, and several other speedy Pokémon (as sand could not always be guaranteed to be streaming) made me decide to change some things around. I concluded that although my main offensive duo worked very well, they were not great Pokémon to fall back on to cover threats. In OU, things don't hit as hard as in Ubers for the most part, so bulky offense is a great stategy. Because of this, things like Gyarados and Hydreigon are very effective in OU, but things like Rayquaza and the poorly defensively typed Electric Arceus, although still somewhat bulky, cannot take many hits. I remedied this by taking out Electric Arceus and Rayquaza and by adding Ho-Oh to the team. Ho-Oh checks all of the common Calm Mind Arcei, Darkrai, Mewtwo, Shaymin-S, Dialga, and several others. It also baits in Kyogre like nobody's business and strips ~80% HP off of the most common Kyogre, Choice Scarf. Second, I added Mewtwo to still maintain constant offensive pressure and check a whole bunch of Pokémon with its amazing speed. I changed some movesets and EV spreads around here and there as well, which led me to the final product that is now set before you (in no particular order)... @ Griseous Orb EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spd Nature: Adamant Will-O-Wisp / Shadow Sneak / Dragon Claw / Dragon Tail Giratina-O is an amazing Pokémon that checks many threats to the team. So many people doubt the effectiveness of this moveset that I got from Roy Mustang's RMT. I think he got it from -Manaphy- anyways, but that's beside the point. Anyways, Will-O-Wisp cripples Arceus, Groudon, and even Ferrothorn quite a lot, as they have a hard time staying alive (and sweeping in the two former's cases) when burned. Dragon Tail is severely underrated; it utilizes the numerous switches it causes with a 90 power phazing move (108 power after Griseous Orb) which makes it an amazing move. It also catches SDing Arcei off guard when I don't want to risk the burn. Personally, I don't see the merit of using 252 SpA EVs and a -SpD nature just to put a big dent in Groudon, who shouldn't be switching into Giratina-O regardless, and to do 35% to Ferrothorn with Hidden Power [Fire] under the omnipresent rain. The rest of the moveset is self explanatory. Shadow Sneak is a 72 power priority move that hits like 1/4 of the metagame super effectively, and Dragon Claw is an effective move to use when the negative priority of Dragon Tail just doesn't cut it. Like, if Normal Arceus is paralyzed and you come in on an Extremespeed/EQ, of course you don't want to lock yourself into Outrage when their Ferrothorn is still at 100% HP, so Dragon Claw works best. You may think this is an unusual scenario, but I promise you, things like this happen all the time in Ubers. I've only missed the raw power from Outrage a couple times, which isn't enough to warrant its usage in my opinion. @ Leftovers EVs: 252 HP / 76 Atk / 180 SDef Nature: Careful Crunch / Stealth Rock / Roar / Low Kick Tyranitar is actually not a bad choice for Ubers because of how many SpAers it checks. I mean, obviously I'm using it for Sand Stream, but outside of that his usefulness is actually decent. It counters Reshiram, Dialga, and several CM Arceus variants, and a few other things. The moveset appears a bit odd compared to the standard Choice Band Tyranitar you typically see in Ubers. Crunch and Low Kick go great together coverage wise. Low Kick is way better than Superpower because it hits almost all the things in Ubers that you would use a Fighting attack against just as hard as Superpower, but without the negative drawbacks. Normal Arceus, Groudon, Kyogre, Dialga etc. give Low Kick 120 power, and things like Darkrai and Ferrothorn are 2HKOed anyways. Stealth Rock is pretty much mandatory on a defensive Tyranitar, and Roar is for pesky boosters and subbers like Calm Mind Giratina, SD Arceus, Sub Ho-Oh and more. I've only missed Fire Blast a couple times because Skarmory is really not super common in Ubers now-a-days from my experience on the ladder, and Ferrothorn is 2HKOed from either Low Kick or Fire Blast so it's not a big loss. The EVs allow me to take a LO Aura Sphere from Timid Mewtwo and live with like 1% HP (lol it's saved me a few times) and OHKO with Crunch. It's necessary to preserve Tyranitar until Groudon/Kyogre are completely wiped out, which isn't that challenging considering how many players, even decently ranked players, foolishly switch in either of them on Excadrill's EQ. Kyogre takes about 85% from EQ and defensive Groudon takes around 40% if my memory serves me right (which means that repeated switch ins to Crunch and Earthquake wear it down fast). @ Leftovers EVs: 252 HP / 8 Def / 248 SpD Nature: Careful Power Whip / Thunderwave / Spikes / Leech Seed An obvious choice for an Ubers sand team due to Kyogre's omnipresence, Ferrothorn is a very good defensive pivot for Dragon, Water, Electric etc. onslaughts by many Uber powerhouses. If I see in team preview that their lead is Kyogre, I always lead with Tyranitar to keep the rain off (so Specs Water Spout doesn't 2HKO) and then switch to Ferrothorn on turn one. This allows me to set up Spikes early on and potentially cripple a Darkrai, Dialga, Ho-Oh etc. with Thunderwave. I have found that using Power Whip instead of Gyro Ball is very beneficial due to all the Groudons who love to switch into me for whatever reason. Also, once Kyogre knows you run Gyro Ball instead of Power Whip, it can spam Surf all day with less worry. Also, when opposing Kyogres see that their Water Spout did around 40% to Ferrothorn, they sometimes like to gamble and stay in, anticipating me to use Spikes which means that I get 3HKOed. Therefore, it's sometimes easy to take Kyogre out of the match and have to rely less on Tyranitar for sand support. Thunderwave is great in the speed centered metagame, and the other two moves are staples on any Ferrothorn set. 248 SpD EVs because Ferro jumps from 361 SpD to 363 from the last four EVs, so therefore he benefits more from 4 extra Defense EVs than 4 SpD EVs. @ Leftovers EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spd Nature: Adamant Substitute / Recover / Sacred Fire / Brave Bird Ho-Oh is amazing bait for Kyogres because they somehow are under the impression that Ho-Oh only spams Fire attacks from atop its chicken perch. After Stealth Rock and a Brave Bird, offensive Kyogres are left with around 10% HP which means that Ferrothorn can come in for free and set up on it while Kyogre either switches out and risks getting another Pokémon crippled or stays in, knowing that it will die to Stealth Rock when it comes in to battle again. Besides baiting Kyogre, Ho-Oh is a great Pokémon that patches my extreme weakness to many different CM Arcei (mainly Ghost, however). On top of that, it's great SpD bulk means that it counters Shaymin-S, Darkrai (when something has been sleep foddered already), Dialga, non-Specs Reshiram, and much more. It is also one of the few Pokémon in Ubers that completely sets up all over Ferrothorn with no risk at all. Ferrothorn's popularity just increases Ho-Oh's usefulness by so much. I'm using Recover instead of Roost because I can set up on Dragon Claw/Stone Edge lacking Groudon and regain my HP without having to be worried about Earthquake. Besides, I am too slow to avoid taking super effective damage from the fast Thunder abusers in the tier so I really am not hurting myself by using Recover. Speaking of Groudon, Ho-Oh and the rest of the team benefit from Groudon switching into Ho-Oh because it powers up Sacred Fire to an insane 225 power after STAB. This provides even more fire power and allows me to dent their team even further so that Excadrill can have an easier time cleaning up. Overall, Ho-Oh is a great asset to this team that gives me great momentum and sometimes seals the match by taking Kyogre out of the picture for the battle. @ Life Orb EVs: 100 HP / 252 Atk / 156 Spd Nature: Adamant Earthquake / Rock Slide / Rapid Spin / Shadow Claw Excadrill is even more amazing in Ubers than it is in OU due to the simple fact that so many people are unprepared for it. Skarmory isn't that common in Ubers as I've previously mentioned, and I've only seen Gliscor about twice; both were times when the opponent was most likely re-using an old team that had Garchomp, who set them into the Uber tier instead of the desired OU tier. Being able to revenge 80% of the metagame under sand is completely phenomenal, but revenging isn't all Excadrill can accomplish. With Stealth Rock and a couple layers of Spikes, Excadrill OHKOs Palkia, Mewtwo, Darkrai (with only Stealth Rock and one turn of Sandstorm) and quite a few more. The only thing it cannot revenge is Rayquaza due to Air Lock, but my team has other ways around that pesky Dragon. The EVs and moveset are probably a bit different from the standard, but they really make perfect sense when you look into what they allow Excadrill to do. The main reason any Excadrill would run Jolly in OU is to utilize an Air Balloon to effectively counter opposing Excadrills, so I went with Adamant for the raw power and for the ability to still outspeed everything in Ubers without a Choice Scarf in the sand. Because I am running Adamant, Excadrill's max Speed is 275, which hits no specific benchmark in Ubers. It would need 280 Speed to outpace Adamant Lucario, Modest Dialga etc., but since I cannot get that high without a Jolly nature, I only need to run 156 Speed EVs to outspeed the standard Rock Polish Groudon before a Rock Polish when sand isn't up, and after a Rock Polish when sand is up. 252 Atk EVs are obvious, and the remaining EVs were thrown into HP to allow Excadrill to take random unboosted Dragon assaults easier. Rapid Spin is essential to my team because Ho-Oh really loves having it off the field so it can perform its job with much greater ease. Shadow Claw may seem out of place, but it hits Giratina-O hard, 2HKOing all but the bulkiest variants. With a little prediction, I can remove their spin blocker and spin rapidly whenever I want as long as I have 1 HP left. I ran Swords Dance for a while, but since the Uber tier mainly revolves around setting up hazards and then trying to sweep, I would always find room for a SD early in the match, but their Groudon/Kyogre would still be alive. On the flipside, I could never find time to SD after their Groudon/Kyogre were fainted because the opponent is usually using all of their offensive force against me by that time. This may seem like rambling jumbled wording to you, but try out Excadrill and you will see exactly what I mean. It simply cannot utilize SD as effectively in Ubers as it can in OU, so therefore, Shadow Claw is a much better option. @ Life Orb EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd Nature: Timid Calm Mind / Psystrike / Aura Sphere / Ice Beam Although Mewtwo doesn't serve any kind of defensively synergetic purpose on my team, it forms quite the offensive pair with Excadrill. Mewtwo easily lures in both forms of Giratina and hits them hard with Ice Beam. In Giratina-O's case, Ice Beam does around 70% to max HP variants from my experience which means that it is no longer a check to Excadrill. If Giratina-O manages to get in on an Earthquake or Rock Slide from Excadrill, I am forced to switch because it can cripple me with Will-O-Wisp or simply take me out with Aura Sphere/Hidden Power [Fire] if I am a bit weakened. When Giratina-O switches in on Mewtwo, however, Excadrill is free to spam Earthquake/Rapid Spin as much as it wants because I know that I can outspeed and KO with Shadow Claw if my opponent is ballsy enough to switch in their 30% HP Giratina-O. In the regular Giratina's case, I am not worried about Shadow Sneak at all, so I can simply 2HKO it with Ice Beam after Stealth Rock because it cannot OHKO back. Aside from accomplishing its job of basically taking both Giratinas out of the match, Mewtwo is a fantastic sweeper, having perfect coverage (except for Shedinja, who dies to sandstorm/SR/Spikes anyways) with these three moves. As soon as Mewtwo is on the field, my opponent is instantly on the defensive, which builds momentum and gives the opponent fewer attacking opportunities overall. Unless my opponent has Psychic Arcues or some ridiculous specialized counter to this form of Mewtwo, something is going to die on the other team 99% of the time whenever I play a game in which Mewtwo gets to play (sometimes Mewtwo doesn't see battle because Excadrill cleans up before it gets a chance). Anyways, I run Calm Mind over Fire Blast because it is much better for putting the pressure on the opponent, sweeping in general, and preventing Scarf Dialga Draco Meteor revenges and such. Fire Blast is really only used for Skarmory and Ferrothorn in the first place, but both are 2HKOed by Aura Sphere regardless. Anyways, there's my team that peaked at number seven. I hope you have enjoyed it, and have a nice day :) Importable Spoiler Giratina-O @ Griseous Orb Trait: Levitate EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spd Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk) - Will-O-Wisp - Shadow Sneak - Outrage - Dragon Tail Ferrothorn (M) @ Leftovers Trait: Iron Barbs EVs: 252 HP / 8 Def / 248 SDef Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk) - Leech Seed - Thunder Wave - Spikes - Power Whip Tyranitar (M) @ Leftovers Trait: Sand Stream EVs: 252 HP / 76 Atk / 180 SDef Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk) - Crunch - Roar - Stealth Rock - Low Kick Ho-Oh @ Leftovers Trait: Pressure EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spd Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk) - Substitute - Recover - Sacred Fire - Brave Bird Excadrill (M) @ Life Orb Trait: Sand Rush EVs: 100 HP / 252 Atk / 156 Spd Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk) - Shadow Claw - Rapid Spin - Earthquake - Rock Slide Mewtwo @ Life Orb Trait: Pressure EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk) - Aura Sphere - Calm Mind - Psystrike - Ice Beam[/HIDE]
First of all, I'd like to praise the format of your RMT and the work you've put on it. It deserves much more love and rates as well. Into the rates: I'm not really an Ubers player, but don't you think that Earthquake on Giratina would be helpful? Your current set is unable to hurt Steel-type Pokemon, which is really bad, even though you can cripple them with Will-O-Wisp. Also, how do you deal with Rayquaza? Excadrill is unable to Revenge Kill him, due to Air Lock, and a set of DD / Outrage / EQ / Overheat is GG. A Choice Scarf Palkia over Ho-Oh seems like a pretty legit option, since it can deal with Kyogre (which is better than luring) and be a boss in general.
Thanks for being brave enough to rate :) To be honest the only common Pokémon that is hit hard by EQ is Dialga, and even then Dragon Claw hits it for good neutral damage on the switch. Ferrothorn is neutral to it and I don't want to stay in so it can set up on me (I'd rather wisp the switch in or double switching to Ho-Oh). Skarmory isn't even affected by it, and most Steel Arcei are very defensive, so I'd rather wisp and switch. I've considered it before, but I don't think it would see enough usage to warrant a slot. You've hit my main problem right on. I don't understand why no one uses Rayquaza! It's actually very destructive... Anyways, you are right, DD Rayquazas 6-0 me if they have Fire Blast, Dragon Claw, and EQ, which is the most common set. If they have Outrage, I send in Ho-Oh to lock it in, then T-Wave it with Ferrothorn and revenge with something else. The thing is to never let it set up. It cannot actually set up on ANY of my Pokémon, though. Even if it means sacking a Pokémon just to figure out its moveset, that's what has to be done so I don't lose. Excadrill OHKOs with Rock Slide after rocks, T-Tar always uses Roar to scout the set (Crunch if it's HP is low enough), Mewtwo Ice Beams, Ferro T-Waves, Giratina Dragon Claws or Tails it, and Ho-Oh BBs it. It cannot set up, but it's a problem if I think it's not a DDer and switch to something else while it DDs. I've tried Palkia, but to be honest I really don't like it that much. It cannot take on CM Arcei like Ho-Oh can, and without Ho-Oh I get 6-0d by Ghost Arceus with CM, Recover, Focus Blast, Judgement. Countering isn't better than luring in this case because Palkia switches in on a Water Spout or whatever and then Kyogre simply switches out, meaning that it's free to come in over and over again. With Ho-Oh, I easily take Kyogre out of the match when it switches in. Plus, I already have Ferrothorn for flat out countering non-specs variants. I suppose I can test it though and try to work in something else to deal with CM Arcei, Shaymin-S, and Darkrai. Thanks for the suggestions and praise :)
Yea, this is definitely one of the most advanced uber teams I've seen. Just from reading this thread, it's pretty impressive at how much thought you put into this team. Double Switching, Using Ho-oh on a sand team, using your offensive core to slowly weaken the oppopent's team, and using underated stuff. I'm pretty impressed because I play ubers a lot, and I don't see many players who put this much effort into their team. So I hope you keep playing ubers along with uu =) As for the team itself, I can't give a proper rate because atm because I'd have to actually play with this team first, and am busy atm. But I do have some advice: 1.] Your team seems to lack a phyiscal wall. It's not really a big deal, but I think it's important that you don't let prominent phyiscal sweepers set up on you [SD normal arceus, SD ghost arceus, lum berry or life orb sd/rock polish groudon[ cuz wisp-o-miss hax], rayquaza, and sub hone claws zekrom could suprise you] or you risk being swept. Just keep that in mind. 2.] Stealth Rocks - If your oppopent has a phyiscally defensive giratina, getting stealth rocks off the field will be troublesome as it completely walls excadrill. It could be bad if your oppopent has something you need Ho-oh for. So yea, just watch out for that in the team preview. 3.] Just from the looks, if you're playing a hyper offense team, or a "wall breaking/stall breaking" team, it could give you troubles. If your oppopent used a combination of darkrai + mewtwo + deo-a, crazy stuff like that, it would force you into unforvable positions. So you'd have to out-play them. But this is only if you're playing a really smart oppopent, as most people don't play at such a high level. I'd classifiy this team as a "bulky offense/balanced offense" ubers sandstorm team with a few suprises. But again, this is more of just advice...I'd have to test this team A LOT before making actual suggestions, but yea. Great team and keep up the good work!
Thanks for the rate (and praise haha) You are correct in that SD Arceus is troublesome, but then again unless you are running physically defensive Giratina and Skarmory on the same team, it's always a bit troublesome. Unless I absolutely need to save a Pokémon (for whatever reason), Arceus never has time to use Swords Dance without being severely crippled in the process. Ferrothorn T-Waves and wittles it down enough with Leech Seed + Iron Barbs so that Giratina can come in and finish it off with Dragon Claw. Sandstorm and Life Orb also allow me to cleverly switch when it's HP is real low if I'm in a pinch. The only real troublesome Pokémon it can come in on is Tyranitar... Low Kick 2HKOs after Sandstorm and SR (it has a chance to live with Leftovers, though), but if it's early in the match and their Kyogre is still going strong, it's hard to decide to stay in and risk getting hit by a Brick Break so I can Low Kick/Roar or switch and risk getting swept or really hurt. I do have to play cautiously around this Pokémon, and I know it. For the most part, when teams have defensive Giratinas, they are more stall based. For this reason, Ho-Oh isn't going to be needed as much because of the typical lack of CM Arceus, NP Darkrai, Reshiram etc. I'm not saying that it's completely useless for the battle, because Ferrothorn and Blissey are both common Pokémon that Ho-Oh loves switching into on stall teams, but as a whole the increase in difficulty to spin hazards when Giratina is on the other team isn't detrimental to my team. Furthermore, Excadrill actually does around 35-40% with EQ/Shadow Claw to a 252/252 Giratina! Add Stealth Rock and Sand stream canceling his Leftovers to the mix and it's actually tough for Giratina to repeatedly switch into battle. As I said before as well, I try to get Mewtwo in early so that Excadrill can clean up the remains, and because of people's tendency's to switch their Giratinas (both formes) into Mewtwo, it's not as easy to spin block as one might think. If I see a team that is very hyper offense, I don't freak out actually because they really aren't super hard to deal with. Typically the really good Uber players run stall based teams (not to say that I haven't seen good people use hyper offense), so when I face a team with Arceus, Darkrai, Giratina-O, Mewtwo, Palkia, Deo-A etc. I normally can successfully predict well against them. Excadrill is also AMAZING against these teams. It 2HKOs every common offensive Pokémon (even Arceus dies to 2 EQs with Stealth Rock down) meaning that if I have to sack something on my team just to switch Excadrill in to take out the threat, it's usually not a big deal. Also, recall how I mentioned how Ho-Oh baits in Kyogres so well; usually the more nooby players love to switch Kyogre into Ho-Oh which means guaranteed sand for the rest of the battle (so Exca can constantly pose a threat to the enemy team at all times). Giratina-O's unique resistances and Shadow Sneak also makes dealing with these kind of teams much easier Haha yeah I played with this team a lot before I made this RMT... I had it for 2 months+ before I decided it was time to post it, so I understand where you are coming from. To me, the only major threat to this team is Rayquaza (specifically Dragon Dance quaza with Fire Blast) because it rapes my team hard once it sets up (so I don't let it set up lol). Thanks again, I appreciate your rating :)