[Approved] Meloetta

Discussion in 'LU Analyses' started by Proof, May 28, 2014.

  1. Proof

    Proof Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2013
    Messages:
    323
    Likes Received:
    854
    PO Trainer Name:
    Proof/Agufmo/Omfuga
    [​IMG]
    Overview:

    Meloetta has been an interesting pokemon ever since it was introduced in Black and White. With its signature move, relic song, Meloetta is able to transform into meloetta-p. It hits a ridiculous speed and attack stat, abusing a base 128 attack STAB close combat and frustration. Meloetta also has cool stats before transforming, hitting a nice base 90 speed, and base 128 special attack and special defense. Meloetta has dual-stabs psychic and hyper voice, allowing it to dent holes into teams as well as having the ability to hit through subs. Meloetta also has a crucial set-up move, calm mind, to boost its fantastic special stats further. Finally, Meloetta has great coverage moves in shadow ball, focus blast, and HP fire.

    Unfortunately, not all is perfect for our ballerina. Meloetta's speed, although decent, isn't enough to outspeed other offensive LU pokemon such as Krookodile and Yanmega. Meloetta-p, although ridiculously powerful, needs a turn to use relic song as regular Meloetta. This attack won't be doing much when physically invested, and has only 75 base power, leaving Meloetta-p open to an attack the turn before. Meloetta is also easily pursuit trapped, specifically by Spiritomb, the only pokemon in the tier immune to Meloetta's dual-stab.
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Choice:
    Meloetta @ Choice Specs/Choice Scarf
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid/Modest Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Psychic/Psyshock
    - Hidden Power [Fire]/Focus Blast
    - Hyper Voice
    - U-turn/Shadow Ball/Dazzling Gleam/Trick

    Psychic will be Meloetta's Primary STAB, which will do massive damage to almost everything in the tier that doesn't resist it. Focus blast is probably the most appealing option, however, the primary steel type in LU is escavalier. There is only one other steel type in this tier (disregarding less commonly seen NU pokemon), being Cobalion, and Cobalion is OHKOd by psychic 81% of the time, so there's really no reason to risk missing focus blast when hp fire has more use. Also, mega Abomasnow is OHKO'd by hp fire, which is nice since Meloetta has the special bulk to tank a blizzard + ice shard from it. Hyper voice is there for obvious reasons, being Meloetta's secondary STAB, and main way of hitting dark types. Shadow ball is to hit psychic and ghost types a little harder than Hyper voice/Psychic. Bronzong is the only example where both moves are resisted (and hp fire is quite weak), and shadow ball is necessary to do damage. Dazzling Gleam is pretty useless, since Krookodile is OHKO'd by hyper voice 81% of the time. It's main niche is being able to OHKO offensive Spiritomb . U-turn should be your last slot here if you're using scarfed Meloetta, but can have usefulness on specs. Scarfed Meloetta is noteworthy, being a nice revenge killer to faster pokemon in LU like Virizion and weakened Cobalion or Raikou.


    Sub Calm Mind:
    Meloetta @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SAtk
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Psychic/Psyshock
    - Hyper Voice/Focus Blast/Hidden Power Fire
    - Substitute
    - Calm Mind

    This set is pretty simple; it abuses Meloetta's ability to make 101 HP substitutes, bypassing seismic toss. Meloetta doesn't have the best defense, but what it lacks in defense, it makes up for in massive HP, special defense, and special attack. It can easily do massive damage even with 0 investment, scaring out pokemon with low special defense. Meloetta running sub calm mind can set up on a lot of LU pokemon, including Registeel (depending on coverage move), Tentacruel, Gligar, Slowking, Cofagrigus, Alomomola, Reuniclus (offensive tr), Politoed, and Goodra. These pokemon are all relatively common, some seen very often, and if Meloetta gets the opportunity to set up, it can sweep teams with relative ease due to its already-high special attack. Psychic will be, again, your primary STAB. Psyshock can be used to win calm mind wars, however, if you're running hyper voice, Meloetta should always stick with psychic, as hyper voice will generally let it win 1v1 calm mind wars. The second move is a toss-up. Hyper voice and Hidden Power Fire will be your most useful options. Hyper voice for obvious dual-stab reasons, and hidden power fire allows Meloetta to hits steel types. The problem with hidden power fire is that it leaves you susceptible to common dark types, but it allows Meloetta to comfortably 2hko Escavalier, and take on Registeel. Thunderbolt is note-worthy because psychic + electric hits all of the singular types. Unfortunately, however, Krookodile is one of the most common pokemon in LU, and will be immune to both of your attacks. Psychic and dazzling gleam are nice coverage, but leave you walled by Escavalier, and hyper voice does good damage against most dark types.

    Relic Song:
    Meloetta @ Life Orb
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Hasty/Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Relic Song
    - Close Combat
    - Frustration
    - Knock Off

    Meloetta-p is essentially unstoppable. Nearly nothing in the tier can wall it thanks to the addition of knock off, alomomola being the only exception, still taking up to 46% from close combat. Gligar and cofagrigus are nice checks, but gligar will be taking a hefty chunk from frustration without an eviolite, and cofagrigus dislikes the powerful knock off. Cofagrigus can still wall Meloetta, since its ghost type prevents it from transforming into Meloetta-p, and regular Meloetta's knock off won't be doing anything. Other than these few, it's hard to stop Meloetta-p. It's not only fast, but it's ridiculously powerful and has perfect coverage. Close combat, frustration, and knock off are perfect physical coverage, being only walled by ghost types who prevent transformation (although Meloetta generally doesn't run relic song, so it's unexpected). Relic song is nice to hit pokemon with an uninvested life orb STAB special attack from Meloetta, which will still do pretty good damage. It also hits through substitutes, like hyper voice. Relic Song also has a 20% chance to put the opponent to sleep (10% + serene grace). Overall, although Meloetta-p is fantastic, it has to use relic song to transform every time it comes in. If the opponent gets their scarfer (or mega aerodactyl) in on meloetta-p, it'll be weakened already, and likely won't get a chance to use relic song again for the rest of the game. Meloetta-p's power is fantastic, but it needs to use Relic Song to transform, which basically hinders its full potential. Hasty nature is to make Relic Song as powerful as possible without investment, but if you'd prefer the extra bulk, jolly is possible.

    Offensive Calm Mind:
    Meloetta @ Life Orb
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Calm Mind
    - Psychic/Psyshock
    - Hyper Voice
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    Another threatening option Meloetta has is Offensive calm mind. It has less raw power than choice specs, and less chances to set up like sub calm mind, but can rip unprepared bulky offense/stall teams to shreds. It's pretty simple, against teams where Meloetta can sweep, find an easy pokemon like Gligar to set a calm mind up on, and continue to sweep with ridiculously strong hits. Against more offensive teams, Meloetta can simply spam its 3 attacks to get kills, or find an opportunity to set up late-game. These moves aren't really interchangeable, the only thing to note is that psyshock is possible to break through special walls.


    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Other Options



      • I've seen Assault Vest Meloetta used, however it doesn't provide much in comparison to mons that can use it better such as Machamp and Escavalier. Meloetta gains more from its raw power and ability to set up.



      • Substitute + Relic Song can be used, but it's risky, and has trouble deciding what to use in its last two slots.



      • Energy Ball can be used to hit Rock types that resist hyper voice, but there aren't many common Rock-types in the tier, and most will take huge damage from Psychic.
    • Meloetta has a variety of support moves, including heal bell and perish song. It can also use u-turn to gain momentum.
    • Finally, meloetta has serene grace, making thunder paralyze 60% of the time, however the low accuracy and the fact that it's weaker than both of its STABs make it unappealing.
    • --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        • Checks and Counters
          • Spiritomb takes any attack bar dazzling gleam.
          • Escavalier is a decent check, only fearing hidden power fire.
          • Entei takes any hit and retaliates with a strong extremespeed.
          • Snorlax is a check, but gets hit hard by psyshock.
          • Porygon2 is a less common counter.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Thanks everyone for reading my first analysis! I look forward to doing more. Feel free to add suggestions.
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2014
  2. Big Bad Booty Daddy

    Big Bad Booty Daddy Big Poppa Pump

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2012
    Messages:
    950
    Likes Received:
    877
    PO Trainer Name:
    -
    In your Other Options, Tornadus-T does not outpace Meloetta-P!

    Other than that, great job. Maybe add a Sub CM Set? And mention how Psyshock can be used on the CM set to win CM Wars and hit Pokemon like Snorlax

    lol wat im illiterate as fuck i cant even read fuck you proof delete your response you're making me look bad
     
    Proof likes this.
  3. Proof

    Proof Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2013
    Messages:
    323
    Likes Received:
    854
    PO Trainer Name:
    Proof/Agufmo/Omfuga
    Changed the first part. There is a Sub CM set, and I do mention how Psyshock can be used...
     
  4. Afro Smash

    Afro Smash Mfw I'm living the Australian dream

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2012
    Messages:
    1,137
    Likes Received:
    854
    PO Trainer Name:
    Afro Smash
    slash Psyshock with Psychic all through out

    Maybe backslash AV on Choiced, list Trick either in Set Comments or as slash

    Sub Calm Mind I'd put Focus Blast > HP Fire as a slash for dark and steels, bar escav which cant take repeated hits anyway

    in OO mention support moves like Heal Bell and Perish Song on defensive sets, could also mention Thunder for its 60% Para rate.
     
  5. Proof

    Proof Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2013
    Messages:
    323
    Likes Received:
    854
    PO Trainer Name:
    Proof/Agufmo/Omfuga
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2014
  6. Dr. Doom

    Dr. Doom Long time hater of stall

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    Messages:
    2,123
    Likes Received:
    110
    Good job on your first analysis. A few changes I'd suggest:

    Change the Choice set to:
    Meloetta @ Choice Specs/Choice Scarf
    Modest Nature (+SAtk -Atk) / Timid Nature (+Spd -Atk)
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EV: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Hyper Voice
    Psyshock
    Focus Blast / Hidden Power Fire
    U-Turn / Trick

    Hyper Voice for power, Psyshock to break special walls, Focus Blast for the Dark and Steel types while HP Fire hits Escavalier, U-Turn can be used to scout while Trick can cripple a wall. I don't think Dazzling Gleam is really worth listing: as you said Hyper Voice OHKOs Krookodile most of the time and Focus Blast wrecks most Dark types anyway. Modest nature for Specs, Timid for Scarf.

    SubCM, Relic Song and Offensive Calm Mind sets look fine. You could stand to mention its niche over Azelf - better bulk and Ghost immunity.

    C&C
    Snorlax is not a counter. A Life Orb boosted Psyshock is a 2HKO on 252/0 Snorlax after Stealth Rock, while Relic Song Meloetta smashes it to bits with Close Combat. Entei isn't a counter either: Life Orb/Specs boosted Psyshock 2HKOs physical Entei after Rocks.
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2014
  7. Proof

    Proof Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2013
    Messages:
    323
    Likes Received:
    854
    PO Trainer Name:
    Proof/Agufmo/Omfuga
    @Dr. Doom I left psychic as a slash since its power is notable over psyshock, and in a lot of cases it'll be more useful. Focus blast is also slashed now, as I see it's useful for hitting dark and steel types, however the only steel types in LU are bronzong, registeel, durant, and escavalier, who all fear HP fire more than focus blast. As for dark types, zoroark and krookodile both get KO'd by hyper voice (krookodile after rocks). Entei is a check because it can do massive damage to meloetta with espeed, and with assault vest tank most of its hit moderately well. Snorlax was changed from a counter to a check.
     
  8. Dr. Doom

    Dr. Doom Long time hater of stall

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    Messages:
    2,123
    Likes Received:
    110
    Fair enough, Psyshock and Psychic are normally slashed and usually comes down to player preference. Personally I prefer Psyshock, but Psychic has its advantages. Assault Vest Entei is a good check (Band is 2HKOd by a Specs Hyper Voice). Oh and Sableye's now moved up to UU.
     
    Proof likes this.
  9. Dr. Doom

    Dr. Doom Long time hater of stall

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    Messages:
    2,123
    Likes Received:
    110
    @Proof

    Entei cannot "take any hit".
    252 SpA Choice Specs Meloetta Psyshock vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Entei: 222-262 (59.6 - 70.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    252 Atk Life Orb Meloetta-P Close Combat vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Entei: 289-341 (77.6 - 91.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
    It will win one on one if no hazards are down, since Flare Blitz and Extreme Speed will 2HKO, so still mention it.

    Don't bother mentioning Thunderbolt outside OO - Energy Ball hits pretty much everything it would. Also, Rhyperior's moved back up to UU, while Tornadus-T has been banned, so don't mention them. You could mention Dazzling Gleam in OO as a more reliable alternative to Focus Blast, but I'll leave that up to you.

    Make the above changes and Approved.
     
  10. Proof

    Proof Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2013
    Messages:
    323
    Likes Received:
    854
    PO Trainer Name:
    Proof/Agufmo/Omfuga
    @Dr. Doom Your calcs just prove that Entei can take any hit and retaliate with a strong espeed. Also, Meloetta-p isn't easy to set up, and you wont be able to throw off CCs that easily. I removed Thunderbolt, and took Tornadus-T, Sableye, and Rhyperior out of the thread.

    I already had Dazzling Gleam on the set, but about 3 posts ago, you told me to remove it...
     
  11. Aurist

    Aurist I do not jump for joy. I frolic in doubt.

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2010
    Messages:
    2,497
    Likes Received:
    540
    Hey I already talked to Proof about this in server, everything that needed fixing (Dgleam, Sball, non-LU pokes etc) is done so approved also hi im QC now 2/3
     
    Proof likes this.
  12. meeps

    meeps Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2012
    Messages:
    936
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    PO Trainer Name:
    meeps
    approve 3/3