sharpedo general - great attack - decent special attack - decent speed, but speed boost turns it into a sweeper - no bulk - nice coverage, physical and special Sharpedo @ Life Orb Ability: Speed Boost EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd IVs: 29 HP Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk) - Hydro Pump - Dark Pulse / Crunch - Protect - Ice Beam - special sharpedo can break physical walls which check physical attacker, and still succeeds against offensive pokemon. - hydro pump is water stab, strongest water-type move it has, can ohko forretress after rocks (phys def) - surf can be used for accuracy but it's weaker - dark pulse for dark stab, can 2hko pokes like alomomola, crunch may be used to allow sharpedo to dent ass vest pokes which otherwise take special attacks very well. - protect to grab speed boost and potentially scout moves like band espeed from entei - ice beam for grass-types like chesnaught, tangrowth, shaymin, etc - appreciates hazard support like the physical set - alternative evs for set with crunch is 152 atk / 252 satk / 104 spd with lonely nature, has enough speed to outspeed noivern at +1 physical Sharpedo @ Life Orb Ability: Speed Boost EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd IVs: 29 HP Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk) - Waterfall - Crunch - Protect - Zen Headbutt - speed boost makes sharpedo a nice late-game sweeper - waterfall obvious water-type stab - crunch obvious dark-type stab, water and dark is really good super-effective coverage in the tier. - protect helps sharpedo get speed boost against obviously faster pokes. - couple of options for last coverage move, zen headbutt good for toxicroak tentacruel, as well as some bulky fighting-types like poliwrath and chesnaught (also virizion but not too bulky physically). earthquake good for stuff like toxicroak, tentacruel, ampharos, raikou. - sharpedo appreciates hazard support. good chance to 2hko phys def aromatisse after sr + spikes, same with porygon2, making it really tough to switch into sharpedo with hazard support - evs obvious, hit hard as possible and fast as possible. adamant because with speed boost it will outspeed everything non scarf at +1 and pretty much everything at +2 - alternative ev spread is 152 hp / 252 atk / 104 spd, allowing it to take priority like espeed from entei or sucker punch from honchkrow better, and outspeeding noivern at +1. it may struggle to outspeed certain pokes without a boost such as timid nidoqueen or nidoking. however it may need to rely on double protect to get to +2 and outspeed mega aerodactyl and scarf pokes. other options - poison jab - ice fang - destiny bond - aqua jet checks and counters - checks vary a lot by set, rather hard to counter sharpedo overall - suicune probably best counter, 3hko by crunch, can rest, do damage with scald while sleeping, and eventually wear down with lo damage. dark pulse from special is also 3hko - whimsicott resists both of sharpedo's stab, but is still susceptible to potential ice beam, it can also ko back with moonblast/giag drain - alomomola, tangrowth, granbull, avalugg are all very reliable counters to the physical set, taking any hit with ease, alomomola can recover and toxic, tanrgowth can giga drain and take out sharpedo, granbull can use play rough. avalugg takes hits with massive physical bulk, and can recover off damage. forretress can take hits well but doesnt do too much back. all four are damaged by special attacker - physical sharpedo lacking zen headbutt is checked by checked by virizion, chesnaught, poliwrath, toxicroak (if lacking earthquake as well). - florges, aromatisse, and snorlax all take hits from special attacker sharpedo quite nicely, and can fire back. all three are 2hko'd by physical attacker though (except aromatisse which needs to be worn down by hazards a bit). - assault vest pokes take hits from special set quick nicely, notably escavalier and tangrowth (which takes physical hits well too) - milotic and vaporeon also take special attacks nicely and can recover off damage (phys def variants of these arent too bad vs physical sharpedo). spdef alomomola may also take special hits from sharpedo nicely, it can also take physical hits well too. - entei cant switch in but can come in and ohko sharpedo with extreme speed - other pokes with priority like mach punch hitmonlee or even mach punch hitmonchan can ko sharpedo.
You've got most things covered here. For notes: I think the HP IV on all of the sets should be set to 29, as it lets you take 27 LO recoil as opposed to 28, meaning that after 3 hits, 29 IV pedo has more HP than one with 31. Personally, I feel the best EVs for pedo's physical / special sets are 152 Def / 252 (S)Atk / 104 Spd. At +1 you outspeed Noivern and the bulk lets you take priority much better. Entei ES goes from 95.6 - 112.9% to 72.4 - 85.3%, while Honch SP goes from 65.5 - 77.7% to 49.8 - 58.7%. I'm not a fan of AJ on Sharpedo. The situations where it's more useful than Protect are extremely limited, so I feel it's better off in OO. Add Noivern to the Ice Fang note, though I think it's better off being in OO along with Poison Jab. Surf can probably be slashed in with Hydro Pump for those who don't like to miss when sweeping. I definitely think the mix set deserves a main set of it's own. The way I'd do it is: Spoiler Sharpedo @ Life Orb Ability: Speed Boost IVs: 29 HP EVs: 152 Atk / 252 SAtk / 104 Spd Naughty Nature (+SAtk, -SDef) - Hydro Pump / Surf - Crunch - Ice Beam - Protect The focus is on SAtk as you'll be using special attacks on most mons. EQ can probably be slashed with Ice Beam, but I feel it's a waste in most scenarios. The main benefit this has over the special set is that you'll need less prior damage to break special walls and assault vest mons, while the obvious negative is that you're weaker to priority. Alomo, Tangrowth and Granbull are all counters to the physical pedo set, while you list them as " very reliable checks". Minor nitpick, as I assume we mean the same thing, but I think it's worth changing.
Destiny Bond should be listed so that it can take out one last pokemon before dying. It clears the path for a sweeper who has the same counter/check as Sharpedo, and it is usually able to execute it because of speed boost. Sure you lose out coverage, but water/dark already has p good dual-STAB coverage. Should at least be listed in OO imo
Agreed on Vuvu's mixed set, though I'd personally slash Earthquake in there as well for coverage (It works after both Crunch and Ice Beam, because Ice/Ground and Dark/Ground both have amazing coverage)
Agreeing with adding D Bond in OO. Don't bother slashing Ice Fang on Physical set imo, its only marginally stronger than Crunch/Waterfall when SE, and noivern is OHKO'd by Crunch after Rocks anyway, It's only use is OHKO'ing Flygon, which I'll admit can be useful since Flygon does not get worn down by Hazards, but that's about the only mon its useful for, so should be moved to OO. I'd say Zen headbutt should be the first slash, it reduces its number of checks quite considerably, and the mons that are hit by EQ are usually OHKO'd/2HKO'd by Crunch/Waterfall after a layer of Spikes anyway. On the mixed set I think Hydro Pump is mandatory since you are using Sharpedo's much weaker Special atack, and you will miss out on a lot more KO's due to Surfs low damage than you will to Hydro Misses. I've not personally used the spread with Def EV's that Vuvu suggested, and I can see how it would be useful to live Priority attacks, however my problem with it is that it vastly inreases the amount of pokemon you need to Protect on first to outspeed, meaning youre potentially giving you're opponents a free switch out to something that can wall/isn't ohkod, and Entei is still OHKOing after Rocks and LO recoil. Also saying yes to a mixed set, with Hydro/Ice Beam/Crunch/Protect, EVs still need to be discussed, but Vuvus for this set seem nice. Also for Checks and Counters, can add AV Tangrowth, which can take Phys or Special hits, Avalugg for walls to Physical set, Sp def momo as a wall to both sets
I'd like you to list the additional Pokémon you need to protect on to outspeed. The only things I can find at first glance are Jolly Hitmonchan(which isn't a mon you want to take on anyway), Modest Nidoking, Timid Nidoqueen and Kabutops. Also, the defensive EVs give you a decent chance(more than 33%) to get a hit off on Entei after having already taken a CB Espeed, one LO recoil and SR. Also, another counter to physical Pedo is Intimidate Hitmontop. Technitop is also a pretty good check to any set as well.
ok changes i will make when i get a chance - hp ivs - add dbond too oo (i was going to be but i wasnt sure if it was legal, wasnt able to check last night) - remove ice fang and aqua jet from physical set, add to oo - make zen headbutt first slash -clear up checks/counters - add avalugg to phys attacker counter and spdef alomomola as special attacker check changes i might make - some defense invest, problem i have is entei will still threaten sharpedo's ability to sweep, as it is only getting 1-2 hits off after espeed, sr, and lo damage. also it'll be slower than mega aero at +1 - slashing surf on special set - making special set first set rathe physical, appears to have fewer checks - adding the mixed set, problem with it is that it struggles vs fairy with hydro + crunch which is the best combo, and does crunch have much merit over dark pulse (as in what crunch may ko on physical set, which the special set cant ko with dark pulse or w/e) yeah would like more feedback on the stuff i might add/change
Yeah I'd say Special set can be first, and going mixed can help break through AV mons like Snorlax/Escavalier/Gallade/Slowking, though you are right in that it leaves you kinda helpless vs Florges, uh also helps vs some more specific mons like Heliolisk, Meloetta, Cryogonal, Lanturn though they are more obscure. I'm not fully convinced it needs the mixed set either tbh, you could maybe just slash Crunch on the Special set and mention EV's you'd use in set comments ? And Hydro Pump is definitely the better option imo, I just did some calcs which i cba to post but, after a layer of SR + Spikes Raikou, Flygon and Cobalion will likely fall to a Hydro Pump, but never fall to a Surf, I'm sure there are many more examples but I'm not gonna calc every mon in the tier. 95 Sp Atk just isn't high enough to run Surf.
Yeah, this probably works best. Also gonna agree that Surf was a bad idea on my part. On Entei Espeed still hampering your sweep, obviously it does, but there's priority users outside of Entei in the tier. You save 20% of your HP on LO Honch Sucker Punch and around 10% from other weaker priority users. These are hits you're likely going to be taking when trying to sweep. At least with Entei you can scout what it wants to do with Protect and move accordingly. Against it specifically the main benefit will be in last 1/2 mon situations and netting the surprise kill on it from time to time when you deem it necessary to take the hit. What you sacrifice for said EVs is the ability to come in on MAero and win 100% of the time(comes down to double Protect 50/50), come in on Modest Nidoking (Timid outspeeds you regardless of EVs, so trying to hit it off the bat is a risk regardless of EVs), Timid Nidoqueen(using Timid on Queen defeats the purpose of running Queen atm), Jolly Hitmonchan(Chan destroys Pedo with Mach Punch anyway), Jolly Kabutops(barely used) and not have to use Protect before attacking. The choice depends on personal preference I suppose, but I prefer the bulk, as I don't find most of the things missed out on to be significant.
done being lazy changes made: - hp ivs - dbond in oo - ice fang and aqua jet to oo - zen headbutt first slash on physical set - c&c cleared up, stuff like avalugg, spdef alomomola, assvest pokes added - mention of alternative defensive ev spreads in set comments - slashing crunch with dark pulse on special set, added alternative mixed spread - switching special attacker to first set
This looks ready to me now, so P.S.: Florges is probably leaving, so you'll want to remove if if / when it does.
Also mention in CC that AV Tangrowth can beat either set (as long as it doesn't switch in on an Ice Beam.)
I think physical should go first with Destiny Bond slashed before Zen Headbutt, it's immensely helpful on something like Sharpedo.