Vanilla

Discussion in 'Active Themes' started by waehofen, Nov 17, 2012.

  1. Tesla Elesa

    Tesla Elesa Almost Quality

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    Oh, you changed it? I'd say taking away vote sniping would just about bring it to par, but fair enough.

    EDIT: Oh, forgot.

    (tentatively) Approved [9]

    Let's give it go, then?
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2012
  2. Jalmont

    Jalmont nothere

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    I think what constitutes an "exception" is a rather vague term. I mean, you could call leaving out x role from whatever theme to be an "exception." At this point we are pretty much arguing semantics (at least I think we are!) so I'm not really go in depth of what we think different things are.

    The only point that I care to respond to right now is your last one (ofc i can talk about the other stuff later if you want). I don't really see how a timing issue = broken mechanic. Timing doesn't break a theme, stuff like distribution of roles, members on each faction etc "break" roles. We could set the time limits to 10 minutes, and it still wouldn't be broken, it would be unplayable. I don't see why we can't pass it through now, play with it a bit, and make a decision from there. Accepting your definition of broken, we still don't know if the timing is broken. That's the point I'm trying to make; we pass it through, see if the timing is too short/too long and fix it from there. That's completely different from taking a role and saying "Well x role is broken, but let's pass it through anyways and see what happens."

    Approved (8)
     
  3. Tesla Elesa

    Tesla Elesa Almost Quality

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    As if it was never about semantics.

    But yeah, the timing issue was maybe not broken, per se, just excessive. I think that waehofen's changes are satisfactory (a whole 15 seconds less was all that it needed to win me over), and it no longer constitutes as a exception. To me, at least.
     
  4. DatXFire

    DatXFire Never gonna use an avatar

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    I think most of what has been needed to be said has been said. My main concern is how well Mafia will receive this and how long the game is going to take. This theme really brings out the true essence of mafia, and is a very unique theme. I am going to go out on a limb and approve (10), welcome to the server Vanilla.
     
  5. Zzyzx Road

    Zzyzx Road Member

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    Coming to be that cool guy who and give the final approval [11]
     
  6. Beast

    Beast I do what I want

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    I believe this still needs another approval. Li and Drapht both said reject so the total right now is just 9 and not the needed 10.
     
  7. Lightwind

    Lightwind New Member

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    And you've got it. I'll approve on this basis alone, besides the fact that I'm really in love with this idea:

    All concerns I might have are things that will be sorted out in playtesting / people learning to be better mafia players. So yeah, make it 12 approvals~!
     
  8. two sides of one coin

    two sides of one coin sick of all her shit

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    This should be...interesting.
     
  9. .Rawr!

    .Rawr! c(°3°)כ

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    Just played this theme like 2 times this week, and my thoughts on it are:

    - Village need relly 100%, and i repeat, 100% on luck to get the baddies . Baddies, in the other hand can kill who they like, nearly always the better know players. And the talk in the day phase don't help on nothing the discover the baddies, simply don't help. The only way what have villies to discover the bad guys is: get a lucky lynch to a mafia, see who didn't follow the lynch so he/she is probably a partner, but anyway this method is still very unreliable.

    - There is a lot of votesniping in this theme. On this point people what always rand is favoured, becos if other people start to rand they can be counterranded.

    - The long day phase time. Not a big issue for me anyway, i'm patient so :)

    So in short, while this theme can teach newcomers how to play mafia, it discourage older players becos it's randomness.
     
  10. waehofen

    waehofen Peace, love, & understanding

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    Update OP with an edit; I'm in a little bit of a hurry but I've found I need the extra time to look through vote/post history sometimes. Very nice, but I might change it back a bit since 110s is dangerously close to the 2m I didn't want.
     
  11. Fuzzysqurl

    Fuzzysqurl baa baa mareep I do what I want Server Owner Developer I do what I want Server Owner Developer

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    I feel like, while it detracts from the "Vanilla" aspect, that all the roles should be poisoned and the game ends the moment it comes to night 9 or 10. This way, the game is hard capped at certain time, and typically, the games don't last that long anyway... however, on the off chance that like, the mafia gets voted off early, slayed, or forgets to kill, the game would be hard capped at a certain time.
     
  12. Kurapika

    Kurapika Born to be a Troll

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    ^ I like the idea? It will challenge both sides giving them a time limit and will limit the time for the theme itself!
     
  13. Li Q. Assir

    Li Q. Assir Mindblower

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    I have a suggestion.

    Add one or two more Mafias to the biggest game. I know it may seem to be even more unballancing, I guess that having a couple more mafias, they could be outvoted earlier and then the firsts voting patterns could be analyzed, making scumhunting based on evidences better. They weren't rare the games that I saw 3 Mafias winning the biggest game. That way, Village could have some more chances early game.
     
  14. Kurapika

    Kurapika Born to be a Troll

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    ^ Makes the game a little faster + Makes it a bit easier to read throught an alliance.
    I guess it should definitely be given a couple of tests.
     
  15. Scatterbrain

    Scatterbrain You only live once*

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    Mind setting the minplayers to 4?
     
  16. Windblown

    Windblown sable knight

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    ***I do not claim to be the 100% rulebook for playing vanilla, but I do think a lot of these observations are properly based

    If you ever take a look at the /windata for Vanilla you’ll notice an almost 3-1 ratio for mafia winning over village. This is really sad, considering vanilla is one of the simplest themes on server and it should not be difficult for village to at least pull to a 50-50 if they do some logical thinking and actually try.

    First, some general guidelines:

    Never tie a vote. The village’s only way to win is to lynch mafia, and how are you going to do that if you tie a vote? This is the same with no lynching, you should be lynching every phase else the mafia is just going to kill you slowly. Only in some specific scenarios should you not lynch, which I will explain below.

    No vote at 4/6/8. If there’s 1 mafia and 4 alive, don’t lynch. If there’s 2 mafia and 6 alive, don’t lynch. If there’s 3 mafia and 8 alive, don’t lynch. The reasoning for this is that if you mislynch here you lose. Statistically, it’s much more advantageous to let a villager die so you have more of a chance to lynch mafia.

    Keep an eye out for bussing, especially if there are experienced players in the game. Bussing is a strategy mafia members do which is pretty general, stretching from either voting their teammate to detract suspicion to even leading the vote on them to pseudo-clean themselves (because the people who vote mafia are usually the cleanest). A note about bussing: this is most likely done in scenarios where there are 3 mafia, because bussing your only partner in a 2 mafia game is actually very disadvantageous to your side, unless one of you is put under heavy suspicion. It’s much easier to win with 2 than with 1.

    Despite what we all say about silent players not necessarily being bad, silent is a bad play style in vanilla. Because there are no power roles, the only thing a villager can contribute is their voice and their vote, so what’s the point of not saying anything? In addition, talking more allows people to read you more accurately, because if you’re town, then hey, you have nothing to hide!

    Speaking of reads (your opinions on people, if they’re village or mafia), typically people will find these things scummy:

    - Panicking when called mafia. It’s an easy reaction test just to point a finger and call someone mafia, and see how they react. If they seem to react out of their usual personality, they’re probably mafia.
    - Not being consistent in their votes and their opinions. If you see someone say ‘x person is mafia’ and then vote y, you should probably lynch them because they seem too eager to lynch anyone that’s not them/their team (alternatively, they may be soft-bussing their partner, which is still scummy).
    - Following wagons without any thought, or trying to get on the wagon without drawing attention. I typically look for mafia around 3rd-5th on mislynches.

    Can’t really think of things that are universally scummy, as a lot of my scum reads are based on people acting out of their norm. To use an example, take a look at user Crobat. If you see him talk in SI, he’s an alien. If he doesn’t say anything, he’s bunker (this tell is 100% accurate, ask the user himself). Forum mafia uses the term “meta” and although this isn’t the most reliable method (but come on, it’s vanilla, nothing will be confirmed), it’s definitely effective against one-dimensional players in server mafia. A lot of people will lurk a lot and say nothing as mafia – I find this to be a pretty widespread tell on server.

    What ISN’T scummy is someone leading a wagon when voting phase begins. You’ll see this a lot in big games, with everyone trying to get a vote off and perhaps luckily hit mafia (hint: it’s not luck). The first voter is probably town. (Now that I’ve said this, watch out for mafia starting to lead votes) There’s no reason mafia would put themselves out there by being the first to vote due to the server’s usual reaction to randing, which is to counterrand. Starting votes is also usual in that when you analyze the voting phase and see split votes, you can probably find mafia due to voting along alignment lines. Especially when people tie votes or make completely useless votes, I usually lynch those because those are moves which have scum motivation.

    It’s honestly hard to objectively make a guide on mafia because you have to learn from experience, and every player is different, so I felt I should just make these guidelines and then perhaps post examples of games here to analyze them and show why certain actions are scummy.

    PS. Claiming mafia is stupid, I will lynch you more likely than not because that is in no way acting pro-town at all

    Here’s a cool sample game to analyze – village did pretty well and it came to LYLO (lynch or lose, in which village outnumbers mafia by 1 so they have to lynch mafia or get endgamed next night).

    (16:55:14) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:55:14) Times Up! :
    (16:55:14) The Roles have been Decided! :
    (16:55:14) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (16:55:14) ±Current Players: -Dranzer Kai-, AnOrange, Beast, Bellerophon, Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Fiery Espeon, George V, Mega Magnamon, Pichi, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Xtina, Zeromare, vanity..
    (16:55:14) ±Time: Night 1
    (16:55:14) Make your moves, you only have 30 seconds! :
    (16:55:14) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:55:17) AnOrange: :)
    (16:55:18) Brainzz: oh
    (16:55:18) Cereal: not mafia here gg
    (16:55:18) Cereal: yes
    (16:55:19) Brainzz: vanilla
    (16:55:21) C.K.Lewis: I was considering space invaders
    (16:55:22) Thomas Sutter: villy
    (16:55:27) Thomas Sutter: everyone claims villy
    (16:55:29) -Dranzer Kai-: if i die im Mafia
    (16:55:29) C.K.Lewis: But I'm not that evil
    (16:55:30) Xtina: Let the chaos, rands based on shit logic, and bussing commence!
    (16:55:30) George V: Rotom request
    (16:55:30) Thomas Sutter: but still...
    (16:55:33) AnOrange: not everyone does
    (16:55:33) Mega Magnamon: Zeromare, I feel your pain bud
    (16:55:34) Riah: villy
    (16:55:34) Brainzz: dat random author of Narnia
    (16:55:35) Bellerophon: ok, let me play better than last vanilla game
    (16:55:35) Mega Magnamon: :3
    (16:55:37) AnOrange: some people dont claim at all
    (16:55:41) Bellerophon: that's CS Lewis
    (16:55:41) Veteran Padgett: villager
    (16:55:44) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:55:44) Times Up! :
    (16:55:44) ±Kill: AnOrange (Villager) died!
    (16:55:44) ******************************************************************************
    Some of my comments might be blocked by hindsight, but my original thoughts are that Cereal and Thomas are scummy. Cereal’s scummy for saying “not mafia” – why would you have to specify this unless you were already self-conscious of being seen as mafia. Thomas’ statement is scummy because after claiming villager he makes a note that “everyone claims villy” which already discredits his own statement. Vet’s villager claim, I’m unsure if it’s related to what Thomas said, but that’s also pretty sketchy as usually he doesn’t say anything if town. Of more importance is that Riah claimed villager and new players generally claim if they are and don’t say anything at all if they are mafia.
    (16:55:44) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (16:55:44) ±Current Players: -Dranzer Kai-, Beast, Bellerophon, Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Fiery Espeon, George V, Mega Magnamon, Pichi, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Xtina, Zeromare, vanity..
    (16:55:44) ±Time: Day 1
    (16:55:44) You have 45 seconds to debate who are the bad guys! :
    (16:55:44) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:55:44) Brainzz: oh
    (16:55:44) Fiery Espeon: voting Mafia out d1
    (16:55:47) Brainzz: close :'
    (16:55:47) -Dranzer Kai-: ok im clean
    (16:55:50) Zeromare: well
    (16:55:51) Brainzz: *close :')
    (16:55:53) Xtina: So, what are we doing here
    (16:55:54) +Beast: get -Dranzer Kai-
    (16:55:57) C.K.Lewis: k
    (16:55:57) Thomas Sutter: we finding mafias
    (16:55:59) -Dranzer Kai-: ohh
    (16:56:01) George V: we are killing anorange
    (16:56:03) -Dranzer Kai-: that MA!!
    (16:56:08) Bellerophon: nah
    (16:56:09) Brainzz: all follow the MA
    (16:56:09) Zeromare: lol
    (16:56:10) Bellerophon: town imo
    (16:56:10) Pichi: oh dang
    (16:56:11) Brainzz: or kill him
    (16:56:12) -Dranzer Kai-: lol
    (16:56:12) Brainzz: :')
    (16:56:13) +Beast: sMA
    (16:56:15) vanity.: villies should be buffed
    (16:56:16) Zeromare: and mod
    (16:56:17) Xtina: ik Thomas
    (16:56:19) -Dranzer Kai-: is better hate MA
    (16:56:20) Xtina: Was talking rands
    (16:56:22) Bellerophon: >buffed
    (16:56:24) C.K.Lewis: villies should have voteshield
    (16:56:26) Bellerophon: >vanilla
    Beast is town because he’s trying to find scum right out of the gate. It’s pretty easy to see what he’s going for – Dranzer trying to come off as saying “I’m clean” because he “didn’t die.” I disagreed cause I saw him just as trolling and he wouldn’t be so outgoing as mafia imo. Brainzz is a bit suspicious here for saying we should “follow the MA” just because he’s an MA or then just “kill him” so I was just really confused by his statement.
    (16:56:28) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:56:28) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (16:56:28) ±Current Players: -Dranzer Kai-, Beast, Bellerophon, Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Fiery Espeon, George V, Mega Magnamon, Pichi, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Xtina, Zeromare, vanity..
    (16:56:28) ±Time: Day 1
    (16:56:28) It's time to vote someone off, type /Vote [name], you only have 30 seconds! :
    (16:56:28) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:56:29) C.K.Lewis: and kill
    (16:56:29) Bellerophon: >voteshield
    (16:56:29) ±Game: George V voted for Cereal! The first voter is town, so I didn’t counter him.
    (16:56:29) ±Game: Fiery Espeon voted for George V!
    (16:56:31) Brainzz: all kill the sMA?:')
    (16:56:31) vanity.: who
    (16:56:33) ±Game: Cereal voted for George V!
    (16:56:34) Cereal: excuse me
    (16:56:34) ±Game: C.K.Lewis voted for George V! This quick counter led me to think that mafia were probably part of the quick counterwagon
    (16:56:35) ±Game: Veteran Padgett voted for George V!
    (16:56:36) ±Game: Zeromare voted for George V!
    (16:56:36) ±Game: Thomas Sutter voted for George V!
    (16:56:36) Cereal: why are you voting me
    (16:56:37) ±Game: Beast voted for -Dranzer Kai-! Beast is still town
    (16:56:38) ±Game: Bellerophon voted for Crazy Player! They usually talk, so I put a vote on them cause I thought they were pretty scummy at this point
    (16:56:38) ±Game: vanity. voted for George V!
    (16:56:40) Zeromare: and he who rands gets randed
    (16:56:41) ±Game: -Dranzer Kai- voted for -Dranzer Kai-!
    (16:56:41) Thomas Sutter: i was doing what, xtina ?
    (16:56:42) +Beast: i wasn't kidding. :(
    (16:56:42) Bellerophon: why would you ever counter
    (16:56:43) Zeromare: lol
    (16:56:43) ±Game: Riah voted for George V!
    (16:56:43) ±Game: Brainzz voted for Beast!
    (16:56:45) ±Game: Xtina voted for George V!
    (16:56:46) -Dranzer Kai-: i know
    (16:56:47) George V: this is vanilla, you assume i have a reason yes, but apparently people can’t figure that out
    (16:56:48) ±Game: Crazy Player voted for Mega Magnamon!
    (16:56:48) Cereal: if it is because I am quiet, I am trying to get scumreads it isn’t how you play the game though, you have to make people act scummy, not wait for them
    (16:56:51) ±Game: Pichi voted for George V!
    (16:56:52) Bellerophon: I know
    (16:56:53) ±Game: Mega Magnamon voted for George V!
    (16:56:53) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:56:53) Times Up! :
    (16:56:53) ±Game: George V (Villager) was removed from the game!

    (16:56:53) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:56:53) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (16:56:53) ±Current Players: -Dranzer Kai-, Beast, Bellerophon, Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Fiery Espeon, Mega Magnamon, Pichi, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Xtina, Zeromare, vanity..
    (16:56:53) ±Time: Night 2
    (16:56:53) Make your moves, you only have 20 seconds! :
    (16:56:53) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:56:54) Riah: next time beast... next time...
    (16:56:58) Zeromare: welp
    (16:56:59) Cereal: well, there is a cool thing
    (16:56:59) Bellerophon: two of the scum are on the wagon
    (16:57:00) Bellerophon: at least THIS IS TRUE. Yes it might be 100% theory, yes it was only true because the counter wagon was so damn big, but it’s a good place for scum to hide in
    (16:57:02) Cereal: it's called psychology
    (16:57:04) Xtina: Nothing, I was just saying you thought I didn't know what was going on
    (16:57:07) Xtina: That wasn't the case
    (16:57:07) Fiery Espeon: fml
    (16:57:11) -Dranzer Kai-: i think i dont die this night
    (16:57:13) -Dranzer Kai-: so
    (16:57:13) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:57:14) Times Up! :
    (16:57:14) ±Kill: Fiery Espeon (Villager) died!
    (16:57:14) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:57:14) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (16:57:14) ±Current Players: -Dranzer Kai-, Beast, Bellerophon, Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Mega Magnamon, Pichi, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Xtina, Zeromare, vanity..
    (16:57:14) ±Time: Day 2
    (16:57:14) You have 45 seconds to debate who are the bad guys! :
    (16:57:14) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:57:16) Xtina: Was looking direction-wise in rands
    (16:57:19) Riah: espeon!
    (16:57:24) C.K.Lewis: dis mafia not gettin nothing tho
    (16:57:28) Riah: nuhuhuhu! :(
    (16:57:29) ±Murkrow: RiceKirby updated the theme SSBB.
    (16:57:30) +Beast: Belle is looking scummy to me too. Still town but misguided
    (16:57:32) Zeromare: inb4 beast and dranzer are mafia in cahoots with each other
    (16:57:35) Thomas Sutter: wow
    (16:57:35) -Dranzer Kai-: vanity. or BalefulKingdra for mafias I think this is a tabfail and he meant beast
    (16:57:37) Bellerophon: for what reason
    (16:57:38) Thomas Sutter: ./start ssbb
    (16:57:39) -Dranzer Kai-: lol
    (16:57:39) Baddie left the channel.
    (16:57:39) Bellerophon: I'm bsy looking at wagons I was actually doing this
    (16:57:40) vanity.: no
    (16:57:40) -Dranzer Kai-: xD
    (16:57:41) Xtina: I've got a sneaking suspicion on Pichi tbh
    (16:57:42) vanity.: im a villy
    (16:57:42) vanity.: pls
    (16:57:44) C.K.Lewis: get kingdra? >tries to get someone not in game
    (16:57:46) -Dranzer Kai-: you got me
    (16:57:51) C.K.Lewis: Or vanity?
    (16:57:53) +Beast: you are busy pretending to be town. Beast pls
    (16:57:53) Zeromare: trying to blame each other
    (16:57:54) vanity.: no pls
    (16:57:56) Pichi: I'm always silent
    (16:57:56) vanity.: i am a villy
    (16:57:58) Bellerophon: two out of { cereal ck vet zero thomas} are scum I didn’t even count some other votes, but this turned out to be pretty accurate
    (16:57:58) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:57:58) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (16:57:58) ±Current Players: -Dranzer Kai-, Beast, Bellerophon, Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Mega Magnamon, Pichi, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Xtina, Zeromare, vanity..
    (16:57:58) ±Time: Day 2
    (16:57:58) It's time to vote someone off, type /Vote [name], you only have 30 seconds! :
    (16:57:58) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:58:00) Zeromare: :O
    (16:58:00) Bellerophon: >pretending to be town
    (16:58:00) ±Game: Crazy Player voted for Mega Magnamon! nvm, probably town
    (16:58:04) Pichi: So you could be leading the village to death
    (16:58:04) Pichi: !
    (16:58:05) Cereal: excuse me
    (16:58:06) +Beast: Saying at least 2 scum were on the wagon. how would you know? again, cause of theory
    (16:58:07) Tayden joined the channel.
    (16:58:08) Cereal: I'm literally not mafia
    (16:58:09) Thomas Sutter: lol
    (16:58:10) ±Game: Veteran Padgett voted for Mega Magnamon!
    (16:58:10) ±Game: Cereal voted for Bellerophon! THIS IS WHY I THOUGHT THEY WERE SUPER SCUMMY, THERE IS NO REASON TO VOTE ME FOR SUSPECTING YOU, ESPECIALLY WHEN I HAVEN’T EVEN VOTED YOU. It seems super defensive and so I carried that scumread on her for a while
    (16:58:11) Bellerophon: vote analysis
    (16:58:11) Cereal: ur mean
    (16:58:12) ±Game: Pichi voted for Mega Magnamon!
    (16:58:13) ±Game: Zeromare voted for Mega Magnamon!
    (16:58:13) Crazy Player: ok
    (16:58:14) ±Game: C.K.Lewis voted for Mega Magnamon!
    (16:58:14) Zeromare: oh well
    (16:58:16) ±Game: -Dranzer Kai- voted for Bellerophon! lol
    (16:58:16) Thomas Sutter: go for it
    (16:58:16) Crazy Player: vote Bellerophon
    (16:58:16) Mega Magnamon: may I ask
    (16:58:17) C.K.Lewis: Wynaut
    (16:58:18) ±Game: Bellerophon voted for Cereal! of course I think Mega Magnamon is town because I didn’t see him on the wagon, so I put my vote here
    (16:58:19) Mega Magnamon: why Crazy Player
    (16:58:20) ±Game: vanity. voted for Mega Magnamon!
    (16:58:20) ±Game: Xtina voted for Mega Magnamon!
    (16:58:20) Bellerophon: good omgus
    (16:58:21) ±Game: Riah voted for Mega Magnamon!
    (16:58:21) Crazy Player: let's go
    (16:58:22) vanity.: worst theme
    (16:58:22) ±Game: Thomas Sutter voted for Mega Magnamon!
    (16:58:23) Crazy Player: vote Bellerophon
    (16:58:23) Cereal: I countered because I like to live
    (16:58:26) Mega Magnamon: is so obssessed
    (16:58:27) Crazy Player: no counter=villager
    (16:58:28) Bellerophon: >I wasn't even voting you yeah this is my point exactly
    (16:58:29) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:58:29) Times Up! :
    (16:58:29) ±Game: Mega Magnamon (Villager) was removed from the game!
    (16:58:29) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:58:29) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (16:58:29) ±Current Players: -Dranzer Kai-, Beast, Bellerophon, Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Pichi, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Xtina, Zeromare, vanity..
    (16:58:29) ±Time: Night 3
    (16:58:29) Make your moves, you only have 20 seconds! :
    (16:58:29) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:58:31) Cereal: idc
    (16:58:32) Bellerophon: you 're too obssessed with survival
    (16:58:34) Cereal: you suspected me
    (16:58:36) Xtina: Can we stop?
    (16:58:38) Xtina: Please?
    (16:58:45) -Dranzer Kai-: Bell or vany choose one Why does this have to be a choice between one of them
    (16:58:45) +Beast: stop what?
    (16:58:46) Bellerophon: Oh no, you suspected me, I better vote you back!!! Yes I am being overly sarcastic here. I just really, really thought that vote was silly
    (16:58:46) Xtina: Pichi and Brainzz for suspects imo
    (16:58:48) Crazy Player: Pichi and C.K.Lewis
    (16:58:49) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:58:49) Times Up! :
    (16:58:49) ±Kill: Beast (Villager) died!
    (16:58:49) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:58:49) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (16:58:49) ±Current Players: -Dranzer Kai-, Bellerophon, Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Pichi, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Xtina, Zeromare, vanity..
    (16:58:49) ±Time: Day 3
    (16:58:49) You have 45 seconds to debate who are the bad guys! :
    (16:58:49) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:58:50) Crazy Player: follow
    (16:58:51) Crazy Player: ed
    (16:58:52) C.K.Lewis: What?
    (16:58:52) Cereal: I'm waiting for villagers to get needlessly randed so I can have true info >two of them have already been voted
    (16:58:53) Crazy Player: too early
    (16:58:56) vanity.: mafia just kill me to prove im villy well this is a dumb mindset, this is just asking for mafia to NOT kill you for the easy mislynch
    (16:58:56) -Dranzer Kai-: stop MA?
    (16:58:56) Crazy Player: and lurking
    (16:58:57) vanity.: pls
    (16:58:57) Pichi: Xtina for suspects imo good OMGUS
    (16:58:59) Zeromare: ok, now vote dranzer
    (16:59:06) Xtina: To answer you Beast, the sarcasm
    (16:59:07) Zeromare: beast wanted him out and now he's dead
    (16:59:10) -Dranzer Kai-: ok now all vote for me
    (16:59:14) Xtina: And you only say me cause I said you Pichi
    (16:59:16) Xtina: lbs
    (16:59:21) Zeromare: if villager.. then he's insane fool
    (16:59:21) pia left the channel.
    (16:59:21) pia joined the channel.
    (16:59:25) Pichi: but who knows
    (16:59:25) Bellerophon: I don't think dranzer is a good lynch I REALLY DIDN’T
    (16:59:30) C.K.Lewis: So get Dranz? good reading comprehension

    (16:59:32) -Dranzer Kai-: lol
    (16:59:33) Bellerophon: ok I missed a spot on the wagon
    (16:59:33) *** Xtina sighs
    (16:59:33) Pichi: you might be leading the village to death
    (16:59:34) -Dranzer Kai-: Bellerophon
    (16:59:34) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:59:34) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (16:59:34) ±Current Players: -Dranzer Kai-, Bellerophon, Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Pichi, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Xtina, Zeromare, vanity..
    (16:59:34) ±Time: Day 3
    (16:59:34) It's time to vote someone off, type /Vote [name], you only have 30 seconds! :
    (16:59:34) ***************************************************************************************
    (16:59:34) ±Game: Crazy Player voted for C.K.Lewis!
    (16:59:36) ±Game: Zeromare voted for -Dranzer Kai-!
    (16:59:36) Crazy Player: no way this is villager
    (16:59:37) ±Game: Veteran Padgett voted for -Dranzer Kai-!
    (16:59:38) Xtina: We are going to lose
    (16:59:38) -Dranzer Kai-: i thin you are scum This literally made no sense
    (16:59:39) ±Game: C.K.Lewis voted for -Dranzer Kai-!
    (16:59:40) Crazy Player: vote C.K.Lewis
    (16:59:40) ±Game: Bellerophon voted for C.K.Lewis! Now this is a vote I can follow – I’ve already explained this above
    (16:59:42) ±Game: Thomas Sutter voted for -Dranzer Kai-!
    (16:59:42) Xtina: There is 0 direction
    (16:59:42) Crazy Player: villagers
    (16:59:43) Bellerophon: for what reason
    (16:59:43) ±Game: Pichi voted for -Dranzer Kai-! YET THE WHOLE VILLAGE DOESN’T FOLLOW, BECAUSE BEAST HAD A SCUMREAD ON HIM
    (16:59:44) ±Game: Cereal voted for -Dranzer Kai-!
    (16:59:44) ±Game: Riah voted for -Dranzer Kai-!
    (16:59:45) C.K.Lewis: Why?
    (16:59:46) Bellerophon: WHY
    (16:59:49) ±Game: Xtina voted for -Dranzer Kai-!
    (16:59:49) ±Game: vanity. voted for vanity.!
    (16:59:50) -Dranzer Kai-: suspect
    (16:59:51) Crazy Player: w/e
    (16:59:51) Zeromare: we'll get lewis next rd
    (16:59:55) -Dranzer Kai-: vanity. or Bellerophon ????
    (16:59:55) Bellerophon: Wow I suspect people
    (16:59:57) Zeromare: suspects man suspects
    (16:59:57) Bellerophon: I must be mafia!!!!
    (16:59:58) -Dranzer Kai-: for mafias
    (17:00:04) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:00:04) Times Up! :
    (17:00:04) ±Game: -Dranzer Kai- (Villager) was removed from the game!
    (17:00:05) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:00:05) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:00:05) ±Current Players: Bellerophon, Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Pichi, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Xtina, Zeromare, vanity..
    (17:00:05) ±Time: Night 4
    (17:00:05) Make your moves, you only have 20 seconds! :
    (17:00:05) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:00:05) Bellerophon: And now you suspect me back
    (17:00:08) Bellerophon: amazing logic
    (17:00:10) Zeromare: welp
    (17:00:10) vanity.: not even a suspect
    (17:00:14) Xtina: ANYONE paying attention to me? I've said Pichi twice, then Brainzz
    (17:00:14) vanity.: villy all the way
    (17:00:22) vanity.: mafia kill me to prove that im clean
    (17:00:22) Xtina: No reply back or anything to go with it
    (17:00:25) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:00:25) Times Up! :
    (17:00:25) ±Kill: Bellerophon (Villager) died! lol
    (17:00:25) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:00:25) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:00:25) ±Current Players: Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Pichi, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Xtina, Zeromare, vanity..
    (17:00:25) ±Time: Day 4
    (17:00:25) You have 45 seconds to debate who are the bad guys! :
    (17:00:25) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:00:25) Crazy Player: Zeromare/ C.K.Lewis/pichu
    (17:00:27) Pichi: The scum is so obvious there's no reply
    (17:00:30) C.K.Lewis: What
    (17:00:32) Cereal: hah, that's funny
    (17:00:35) C.K.Lewis: Zero's proven inno.
    (17:00:38) Zeromare: well let;s nail lewis
    (17:00:39) Cereal: I was about to say that I suspected Belle
    (17:00:42) C.K.Lewis: And how I am I evil?
    (17:00:45) Cereal: well, Belle's dead, look at that
    (17:00:47) Xtina: Can we please just get Pichi?
    (17:00:48) Veteran Padgett: C.K.Lewis how is zero innocent?
    (17:00:49) Crazy Player: um Cereal.really ?
    (17:00:52) Zeromare: if it ain't him crazy can kiss my ass
    (17:00:58) Zeromare: and dies next rd
    (17:01:05) Pichi: Can we please just counter vote? tbf, this is very scummy play to just suspect anyone suspecting you OH LOOK THAT’S WHAT PEOPLE DID TO ME
    (17:01:05) Crazy Player: why would Bellerophon.be mafia when he doesn't push mislynches I DON’T PUSH MISLYNCHES, THANK YOU
    (17:01:09) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:01:09) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:01:09) ±Current Players: Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Pichi, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Xtina, Zeromare, vanity..
    (17:01:09) ±Time: Day 4
    (17:01:09) It's time to vote someone off, type /Vote [name], you only have 30 seconds! :
    (17:01:09) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:01:11) Xtina: How about no
    (17:01:13) ±Game: Xtina voted for Pichi!
    (17:01:14) ±Game: Pichi voted for Xtina!
    (17:01:16) ±Game: Veteran Padgett voted for Xtina!
    (17:01:17) ±Game: C.K.Lewis voted for Pichi!
    (17:01:17) Pichi: How about yes?
    (17:01:18) ±Game: Zeromare voted for Pichi!
    (17:01:19) Xtina: You bat the attention off of yourself
    (17:01:20) ±Game: vanity. voted for Pichi!
    (17:01:21) ±Game: Thomas Sutter voted for Pichi!
    (17:01:21) Xtina: Enough
    (17:01:21) ±Game: Riah voted for Pichi!
    (17:01:22) Cereal: are you saying that like every mafia does that
    (17:01:22) Zeromare: dat counter
    (17:01:23) ±Game: Cereal voted for Pichi!
    (17:01:24) Cereal: no
    (17:01:28) vanity.: Veteran Padgett for partner if this is mafia
    (17:01:28) Pichi: Village cat out
    (17:01:29) ±Game: Crazy Player voted for Pichi!
    (17:01:30) Zeromare: either xtina or pichi are mafia WHY SO MANY FALSE DICHOTOMIES, WHY DOES IT HAVE TO BE ONE OR THE OTHER
    (17:01:30) C.K.Lewis: Thought we were gonna vote me tbf we should’ve
    (17:01:32) Cereal: also I just think is scummy
    (17:01:33) Cereal: yes
    (17:01:39) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:01:39) Times Up! :
    (17:01:39) ±Game: Pichi (Villager) was removed from the game!
    (17:01:39) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:01:39) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:01:39) ±Current Players: Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Xtina, Zeromare, vanity..
    (17:01:40) ±Time: Night 5
    (17:01:40) Make your moves, you only have 20 seconds! :
    (17:01:40) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:01:41) C.K.Lewis: Guess I'm still inno in your eyes. Sarcasm this is very, very self-conscious
    (17:01:43) Crazy Player: ._.
    (17:01:47) Riah: :x
    (17:01:50) vanity.: omg mafia
    (17:01:51) Xtina: Welp, makes me scum then
    (17:01:52) vanity.: just kill me
    (17:01:53) Zeromare: we were, just ppl keep pushing their own agendas
    (17:01:55) vanity.: you bitch
    (17:01:55) Xtina: At least I tried
    (17:01:57) C.K.Lewis: Yeah, Xtina
    (17:01:58) Cereal: literally haven't gotten a single mafia
    (17:01:59) Zeromare: xtina dies next rd
    (17:01:59) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:01:59) Times Up! :
    (17:02:00) ±Kill: Xtina (Villager) died!
    (17:02:00) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:02:00) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:02:00) ±Current Players: Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Zeromare, vanity..
    (17:02:00) ±Time: Day 5
    (17:02:00) You have 45 seconds to debate who are the bad guys! :
    (17:02:00) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:02:03) C.K.Lewis: lol
    (17:02:03) Riah: lol
    (17:02:03) vanity.: rekt
    (17:02:05) Zeromare: LOL
    (17:02:10) Zeromare: i was meaning on the vote..
    (17:02:17) Zeromare: now we get crazy
    (17:02:21) Zeromare: he was wrong about pichi ?????
    (17:02:21) Riah: ok, either way...
    (17:02:30) Crazy Player: can we vote C.K.Lewis. already ?
    (17:02:31) Baddie joined the channel.
    (17:02:34) C.K.Lewis: No.
    (17:02:39) Thomas Sutter: i always silent..
    (17:02:42) Cereal: or, both of them could be villagers
    (17:02:44) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:02:44) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:02:44) ±Current Players: Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Crazy Player, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Zeromare, vanity..
    (17:02:44) ±Time: Day 5
    (17:02:44) It's time to vote someone off, type /Vote [name], you only have 30 seconds! :
    (17:02:44) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:02:45) ±Game: Crazy Player voted for C.K.Lewis!
    (17:02:45) ±Game: Veteran Padgett voted for Zeromare!
    (17:02:45) ±Game: Zeromare voted for Crazy Player! It’s really amazing that this counter happens, it was really dumb
    (17:02:46) ±Game: vanity. voted for Crazy Player!
    (17:02:48) Zeromare: vote crazy
    (17:02:49) ±Game: C.K.Lewis voted for Crazy Player!
    (17:02:50) vanity.: git rekt
    (17:02:51) Cereal: this game is so chaotic it's ridiculous
    (17:02:51) C.K.Lewis: Sure
    (17:02:53) ±Game: Cereal voted for Crazy Player!
    (17:02:53) Zeromare: oh veteran..
    (17:02:54) ±Dratini: spokemon king was muted by Angelus for 1 hour! [Reason: rule 5] [Channel: Tohjo Falls]
    (17:02:54) ±Game: Riah voted for Crazy Player!
    (17:02:57) Zeromare: you're next
    (17:02:57) C.K.Lewis: Guys been getting on me
    (17:03:00) Cereal: personally just bandwagoning in case of mafia
    (17:03:01) ±Game: Thomas Sutter voted for Crazy Player!
    (17:03:01) vanity.: this theme is so horrible
    (17:03:02) Crazy Player: my guess is Zeromare C.K.Lewis
    (17:03:03) Crazy Player: and
    (17:03:05) Crazy Player: someone
    (17:03:08) Crazy Player: maybe vanity.
    (17:03:09) Crazy Player: idk
    (17:03:11) Crazy Player: maybe not
    (17:03:11) Cereal: this theme is good when people understand what psychology is
    (17:03:14) Crazy Player: Thomas Sutter town
    (17:03:14) C.K.Lewis: Zero is innocence incarnate
    (17:03:14) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:03:14) Times Up! :
    (17:03:14) ±Game: Crazy Player (Villager) was removed from the game!
    (17:03:14) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:03:14) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:03:14) ±Current Players: Brainzz, C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Zeromare, vanity..
    (17:03:14) ±Time: Night 6
    (17:03:14) Make your moves, you only have 20 seconds! :
    (17:03:14) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:03:16) vanity.: pls
    (17:03:18) Zeromare: WOW
    (17:03:19) vanity.: im mafia
    (17:03:23) C.K.Lewis: No, this theme is good for trolling
    (17:03:25) Zeromare: villagers accusing villagers
    (17:03:26) Riah: D":
    (17:03:31) vanity.: does it take a genius to figure that out
    (17:03:31) Cereal: trolling is bad and trollers should feel bad
    (17:03:33) Thomas Sutter: yup
    (17:03:34) Zeromare: and we HAVE TO GET MAFIA
    (17:03:34) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:03:34) Times Up! :
    (17:03:34) ±Kill: Brainzz (Villager) died!
    (17:03:34) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:03:34) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:03:34) ±Current Players: C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Zeromare, vanity..
    (17:03:34) ±Time: Day 6
    (17:03:34) You have 45 seconds to debate who are the bad guys! :
    (17:03:34) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:03:39) Cereal: anyways, CK seems like a misguided villager I saw this as scum reluctantly townreading scum
    (17:03:39) Zeromare: or it's over
    (17:03:43) Riah: ...
    (17:03:45) Riah: we r rekt
    (17:03:47) Zeromare: veteran goes down next Zeromare was lucky with this vote, this was horrible logic
    (17:03:50) Veteran Padgett: why
    (17:03:52) vanity.: auto win for mafia
    (17:03:54) vanity.: btw im villy
    (17:03:56) Zeromare: hm you voted me
    (17:03:56) Veteran Padgett: because i voted you, the scum?
    (17:03:59) vanity.: you lynch me you lose
    (17:04:01) Zeromare: i ain't scum
    (17:04:06) Veteran Padgett: oh please
    (17:04:11) Cereal: so, I hate everyone, I hate everything
    (17:04:19) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:04:19) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:04:19) ±Current Players: C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Veteran Padgett, Zeromare, vanity..
    (17:04:19) ±Time: Day 6
    (17:04:19) It's time to vote someone off, type /Vote [name], you only have 30 seconds! :
    (17:04:19) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:04:20) ±Game: Veteran Padgett voted for Zeromare!
    (17:04:20) ±Game: Zeromare voted for Veteran Padgett!
    (17:04:21) Cereal: I don't care anymore just follow me if you think I am right yes
    (17:04:22) vanity.: cereal confirmed mag
    (17:04:22) ±Game: Cereal voted for Veteran Padgett!
    (17:04:23) Zeromare: get vet
    (17:04:23) ±Game: Riah voted for Veteran Padgett!
    (17:04:24) vanity.: *maf
    (17:04:24) ±Game: C.K.Lewis voted for Veteran Padgett!
    (17:04:27) ±Game: vanity. voted for Veteran Padgett!
    (17:04:32) Cereal: how am I confirmed you're bad at this pls
    (17:04:49) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:04:49) Times Up! :
    (17:04:49) ±Game: Veteran Padgett (Mafia) was removed from the game! So, this cleans people…but not everyone. The first three voters are fine, then after that it gets suspicious. So I had suspicion on Thomas for not voting at all, then CK over vanity, because vanity seemed like an exasperated villager
    (17:04:49) ******************************************************************************
    *********
    (17:04:49) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:04:49) ±Current Players: C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Zeromare, vanity..
    (17:04:49) ±Time: Night 7
    (17:04:50) Make your moves, you only have 20 seconds! :
    (17:04:50) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:04:50) megaman zerou left the channel.
    (17:04:53) vanity.: knew he was bad
    (17:04:54) Zeromare: YES
    (17:04:55) C.K.Lewis: Nice.
    (17:04:56) Cereal: woah look I was right
    (17:04:58) C.K.Lewis: First one
    (17:05:02) vanity.: didn't i call it
    (17:05:03) Cereal: so that means kill me blah blah
    (17:05:06) Cereal: vanity is scummy imho
    (17:05:09) Zeromare: riah/thomas
    (17:05:10) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:05:10) Times Up! :
    (17:05:10) No one died! : lol
    (17:05:10) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:05:10) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:05:10) ±Current Players: C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Zeromare, vanity..
    (17:05:10) ±Time: Day 7
    (17:05:10) You have 45 seconds to debate who are the bad guys! :
    (17:05:10) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:05:10) vanity.: pls im villeh
    (17:05:14) Cereal: haha nice
    (17:05:14) vanity.: even though i said im maf
    (17:05:15) Zeromare: do NOT rand
    (17:05:16) C.K.Lewis: vanity is scummy.
    (17:05:17) vanity.: im still villy
    (17:05:18) C.K.Lewis: But...
    (17:05:19) Zeromare: we're at 6
    (17:05:23) Cereal: Zero has a point
    (17:05:25) Zeromare: we miss, mafia wins
    (17:05:31) C.K.Lewis: riah has been silent
    (17:05:41) vanity.: isn't he usually silent
    (17:05:51) C.K.Lewis: vanity, trying to say something?
    (17:05:54) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:05:54) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:05:54) ±Current Players: C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Zeromare, vanity..
    (17:05:54) ±Time: Day 7
    (17:05:54) It's time to vote someone off, type /Vote [name], you only have 30 seconds! :
    (17:05:54) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:06:00) vanity.: maybe he's silent because this theme is so boring
    (17:06:04) C.K.Lewis: Ok, Zero
    (17:06:06) Cereal: if this theme is so boring
    (17:06:08) Cereal: why did you join
    (17:06:09) Zeromare: no vote
    (17:06:15) vanity.: good point
    (17:06:15) Zeromare: we miss, they win
    (17:06:19) Riah: lag
    (17:06:24) ±Dratini: guest40002 was mysteriously kicked by Raducan!
    (17:06:24) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:06:24) Times Up! :
    (17:06:24) No one was voted off!:
    (17:06:24) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:06:25) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:06:25) ±Current Players: C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Riah, Thomas Sutter, Zeromare, vanity..
    (17:06:25) ±Time: Night 8
    (17:06:25) Make your moves, you only have 20 seconds! :
    (17:06:25) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:06:32) aei: Hello, Mafia! Please kill tonight to avoid being detained or mafiabanned for stalling!
    (17:06:37) aei: Thank you! :)
    (17:06:38) Riah: we loz?
    (17:06:40) Crobat: (Seiously.)
    (17:06:43) Crobat: Seriously*
    (17:06:44) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:06:44) Times Up! :
    (17:06:44) ±Kill: Zeromare (Villager) died! Killing clean, pretty good play
    (17:06:44) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:06:44) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:06:44) ±Current Players: C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Riah, Thomas Sutter, vanity..
    (17:06:44) ±Time: Day 8
    (17:06:44) You have 45 seconds to debate who are the bad guys! :
    (17:06:44) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:06:46) C.K.Lewis: not yet...
    (17:06:46) Cereal: that spelling
    (17:06:49) C.K.Lewis: Ok.
    (17:06:53) C.K.Lewis: We need to be perfect
    (17:06:59) Riah: ck 4 mafia?
    (17:07:03) Cereal: so, in pm, I was talking w/ Zero and Zero said Riah and THomas are the scummiest
    (17:07:05) C.K.Lewis: Nice. accuse me
    (17:07:06) vanity.: inb4 van's bad because zzzz
    (17:07:14) C.K.Lewis: So get Riah first and Thomas nex?t This is a scum-motivated move, cause he’s trying to get his partner saved – but this might be because I had a town read on Riah
    (17:07:19) C.K.Lewis: *next?
    (17:07:22) Cereal: wait, who is more scummy
    (17:07:26) C.K.Lewis: not sure.
    (17:07:26) Cereal: Zero may be wrong who knows
    (17:07:29) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:07:29) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:07:29) ±Current Players: C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Riah, Thomas Sutter, vanity..
    (17:07:29) ±Time: Day 8
    (17:07:29) It's time to vote someone off, type /Vote [name], you only have 30 seconds! :
    (17:07:29) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:07:33) C.K.Lewis: Well, we need to vote
    (17:07:39) Cereal: I think thomas
    (17:07:41) ±Game: Cereal voted for Thomas Sutter!
    (17:07:45) Cereal: I hope I'm right
    (17:07:47) ±Game: vanity. voted for Thomas Sutter!
    (17:07:48) ±Game: C.K.Lewis voted for Thomas Sutter!
    (17:07:54) ±Game: Riah voted for Thomas Sutter!
    (17:07:58) C.K.Lewis: Hope you're right. This really, really looks like buttering up
    (17:08:02) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:08:02) Times Up! :
    (17:08:02) ±Game: Thomas Sutter (Mafia) was removed from the game!
    (17:08:02) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:08:02) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (17:08:02) ±Current Players: C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Riah, vanity..
    (17:08:02) ±Time: Night 9
    (17:08:02) Make your moves, you only have 20 seconds! :
    (17:08:02) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:08:07) Cereal: rad
    (17:08:10) C.K.Lewis: So close... I can’t believe it’s not butter!
    (17:08:12) Riah: :D
    (17:08:12) vanity.: riah reluctantly voted i think.
    (17:08:16) MewtwoHidden joined the channel.
    (17:08:18) Cereal: riah is prolly mafia
    (17:08:21) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:08:21) Times Up! :
    (17:08:21) ±Kill: vanity. (Villager) died!
    (17:08:21) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:08:21) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Villager, Villager.
    (17:08:21) ±Current Players: C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Riah.
    (17:08:21) ±Time: Day 9
    (17:08:21) You have 45 seconds to debate who are the bad guys! :
    (17:08:21) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:08:22) Cereal: but hey, I may be wrong
    (17:08:28) C.K.Lewis: Well.
    (17:08:30) Cereal: hm, interesting
    (17:08:31) Riah: ck is maf
    (17:08:37) C.K.Lewis: It's one of us..
    (17:08:43) C.K.Lewis: And I have to believe it's riah
    (17:08:48) Withoutatrace joined the channel.
    (17:09:06) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:09:06) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Villager, Villager.
    (17:09:06) ±Current Players: C.K.Lewis, Cereal, Riah.
    (17:09:06) ±Time: Day 9
    (17:09:06) It's time to vote someone off, type /Vote [name], you only have 30 seconds! :
    (17:09:06) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:09:08) ±Game: Riah voted for C.K.Lewis!
    (17:09:10) ±Game: C.K.Lewis voted for Riah!
    (17:09:11) ±Game: Cereal voted for Riah!
    (17:09:12) ***************************************************************************************
    (17:09:12) Times Up! :
    (17:09:12) ±Game: Riah (Villager) was removed from the game!
    (17:09:12) ±Game: The Mafia (C.K.Lewis) wins!
    (17:09:12) ±Game: The Village (Cereal) lose!
    (17:09:12) ***************************************************************************************
    Village played an okay game, they just forgot to LYNCH CK AFTER CRAZY FLIPPED TOWN, as well as looking at some associative tells between CK and Thomas. By the way I was pretty accurate in my theory that at least 2 scum were on the wagon – in fact, they were quick to counter George.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2014
  17. Veteran Padgett

    Veteran Padgett TFT Main Developer Developer

    Joined:
    May 31, 2013
    Messages:
    307
    Likes Received:
    274
    PO Trainer Name:
    Veteran Padgett
    lol When I read this, and next game I am mafia with Windblown playing I don't say anything and win.

    Another example of how you have to know the other players' mindsets.
     
  18. Windblown

    Windblown sable knight

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2012
    Messages:
    841
    Likes Received:
    169
    That's because I had much more suspicious people to lynch and I was going to talk to you in LYLO if I made it.
    (23:17:58) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:17:58) Times Up! :
    (23:17:58) The Roles have been Decided! :
    (23:17:58) ±Game: You are a Villager!
    (23:17:58) ±Game: Hi! You're a Villager, but you don't have any special abilities :(
    (23:17:58) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (23:17:58) ±Current Players: Batman, Easten, Flesh, Jinora, Laser Kirby, Micaiah, TraceOfLife, Veteran Padgett, Windblown, Xenon.
    (23:17:58) ±Current Team: Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager
    (23:17:58) ±Time: Night 1
    (23:17:58) Make your moves, you only have 30 seconds! :
    (23:17:58) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:18:00) Xenon: bye rehx
    (23:18:04) Batman: Ekins owns Arceus
    (23:18:04) TraceOfLife: aww, not mafia
    (23:18:06) Rehx left the channel.
    (23:18:08) Windblown: TraceOfLife is mafia
    (23:18:09) Laser Kirby: awww
    (23:18:10) Jinora: that is a good thing
    (23:18:10) WilsonA021s left the channel.
    (23:18:12) Micaiah: People ditching cause of windblown
    (23:18:12) Flesh: Lol.
    (23:18:16) Windblown: m a d
    (23:18:23) Xenon: mafia with windblown
    (23:18:26) Jinora: run from wind
    (23:18:27) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:18:27) Times Up! :
    (23:18:27) ±Kill: Laser Kirby (Villager) died!
    (23:18:27) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:18:27) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (23:18:27) ±Current Players: Batman, Easten, Flesh, Jinora, Micaiah, TraceOfLife, Veteran Padgett, Windblown, Xenon.
    (23:18:27) ±Current Team: Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager
    (23:18:27) ±Time: Day 1
    (23:18:27) You have 45 seconds to debate who are the bad guys! :
    (23:18:27) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:18:27) Xenon: I think we should rand alphabetically
    (23:18:32) Windblown: *reverse
    (23:18:33) Batman: no
    (23:18:33) TraceOfLife: Wat
    (23:18:33) Windblown: wait
    (23:18:33) Windblown: no
    (23:18:33) Jinora: that is stupid
    (23:18:36) Crobat: lol
    (23:18:39) Easten: neh
    (23:18:41) Windblown: Jinora and Batman confirmed scum team
    (23:18:45) TraceOfLife left the channel.
    (23:18:48) TraceOfLife joined the channel.
    (23:18:49) Jinora: nah
    (23:18:49) Xenon: ^
    (23:18:50) Flesh: After TraceOfLife?
    (23:18:55) Batman: Stop
    (23:18:56) Windblown: can't tell who's scum
    (23:18:58) Windblown: trace probably isn't
    (23:19:05) Batman: This always happens
    (23:19:12) Windblown: playing victim card
    (23:19:12) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:19:12) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (23:19:12) ±Current Players: Batman, Easten, Flesh, Jinora, Micaiah, TraceOfLife, Veteran Padgett, Windblown, Xenon.
    (23:19:12) ±Current Team: Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager
    (23:19:12) ±Time: Day 1
    (23:19:12) It's time to vote someone off, type /Vote [name], you only have 30 seconds! :
    (23:19:12) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:19:12) Jinora: does Veteran Padgett usually talk
    (23:19:13) ±Game: Micaiah voted for Flesh!
    (23:19:17) ±Game: Xenon voted for Flesh!
    (23:19:17) Flesh: ..
    (23:19:18) Micaiah: I feel this
    (23:19:18) Flesh: Why?
    (23:19:19) Windblown: only as mafia
    (23:19:19) TraceOfLife: back from
    (23:19:20) ±Game: Flesh voted for Micaiah!
    (23:19:20) Xenon: no
    (23:19:21) ±Game: Windblown voted for Xenon!
    (23:19:21) Xenon: not today
    (23:19:22) Windblown: flash lynch
    (23:19:23) TraceOfLife: disconnected
    (23:19:24) Xenon: wat
    (23:19:24) Windblown: flash lynch whooooa
    (23:19:26) ±Game: Veteran Padgett voted for Flesh!
    (23:19:27) ±Game: TraceOfLife voted for Flesh!
    (23:19:29) ±Game: Easten voted for Xenon!
    (23:19:32) ±Game: Jinora voted for Flesh!
    (23:19:34) Flesh: Okay Micaiah
    (23:19:34) Jinora: if not mafia
    (23:19:35) Flesh: Scum.
    (23:19:35) Jinora: then xenon
    (23:19:36) Micaiah: xenon probs scum
    (23:19:36) Xenon: if it was any other day then padgett would be scum
    (23:19:39) Jinora: for fast vote
    (23:19:41) Xenon: if I was scum
    (23:19:42) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:19:42) Times Up! :
    (23:19:42) ±Game: Flesh (Villager) was removed from the game!
    (23:19:42) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:19:42) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (23:19:42) ±Current Players: Batman, Easten, Jinora, Micaiah, TraceOfLife, Veteran Padgett, Windblown, Xenon.
    (23:19:42) ±Current Team: Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager
    (23:19:42) ±Time: Night 2
    (23:19:42) Make your moves, you only have 20 seconds! :
    (23:19:42) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:19:46) Xenon: I would kill alphabetically
    (23:19:50) Xenon: laser kirby is not first alphabetically
    (23:19:54) Micaiah: Teammate change kill
    (23:19:56) Windblown: wifom
    (23:19:57) Micaiah: !
    (23:19:59) Xenon: I don't lie about killing alphabetically.
    (23:20:02) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:20:02) Times Up! :
    (23:20:02) ±Kill: TraceOfLife (Villager) died!
    (23:20:02) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:20:02) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (23:20:02) ±Current Players: Batman, Easten, Jinora, Micaiah, Veteran Padgett, Windblown, Xenon.
    (23:20:02) ±Current Team: Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager
    (23:20:02) ±Time: Day 2
    (23:20:02) You have 45 seconds to debate who are the bad guys! :
    (23:20:02) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:20:04) Jinora: wifom is confusing
    (23:20:06) Windblown: I DON'T LIE ABOUT ANYTHING AND THIS IS MAFIA
    (23:20:13) Xenon: I lie about other things
    (23:20:17) Xenon: not alphabetical-related subjects
    (23:20:22) Windblown: ????????????????
    (23:20:24) Jinora: xenon pls
    (23:20:25) Easten: ...
    (23:20:26) -n_n- joined the channel.
    (23:20:29) Jinora: and you have a partner
    (23:20:31) Micaiah: we at 7
    (23:20:31) Windblown: mental note to kill alphabetically in vanilla games with Xenon
    (23:20:32) -n_n- left the channel.
    (23:20:33) TraceOfLife left the channel.
    (23:20:38) TraceOfLife joined the channel.
    (23:20:41) Windblown: w/e not lynching him
    (23:20:44) Windblown: still gonna lynch batman y/n
    (23:20:45) Xenon: Batman is scum
    (23:20:47) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:20:47) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (23:20:47) ±Current Players: Batman, Easten, Jinora, Micaiah, Veteran Padgett, Windblown, Xenon.
    (23:20:47) ±Current Team: Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager
    (23:20:47) ±Time: Day 2
    (23:20:47) It's time to vote someone off, type /Vote [name], you only have 30 seconds! :
    (23:20:47) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:20:48) ±Game: Xenon voted for Batman!
    (23:20:49) Jinora: huh
    (23:20:50) Batman: no
    (23:20:50) Jinora: why
    (23:20:53) ±Game: Jinora voted for Xenon!
    (23:20:55) ±Game: Windblown voted for Batman!
    (23:20:55) Xenon: jinora partner
    (23:20:56) Xenon: imo
    (23:20:57) Windblown: scumteam found
    (23:20:57) ±Game: Veteran Padgett voted for Batman!
    (23:20:58) ±Game: Batman voted for Xenon!
    (23:20:58) ±Game: Micaiah voted for Batman!
    (23:21:00) Jinora: easy target for xenon
    (23:21:04) ±Game: Easten voted for Xenon!
    (23:21:04) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:21:04) Times Up! :
    (23:21:04) ±Game: Batman (Villager) was removed from the game!
    (23:21:04) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:21:04) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (23:21:04) ±Current Players: Easten, Jinora, Micaiah, Veteran Padgett, Windblown, Xenon.
    (23:21:04) ±Current Team: Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager
    (23:21:04) ±Time: Night 3
    (23:21:04) Make your moves, you only have 20 seconds! :
    (23:21:04) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:21:08) Windblown: o
    (23:21:08) Micaiah: though
    (23:21:13) Xenon: maybe not
    (23:21:18) Xenon: I think
    (23:21:20) Jinora: opportunistic vote
    (23:21:20) Micaiah: Windy is probs bot scum
    (23:21:21) Xenon: lynch padgett
    (23:21:21) Xenon: then
    (23:21:24) Windblown: >bot scum
    (23:21:24) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:21:24) Times Up! :
    (23:21:24) No one died! :
    (23:21:24) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:21:24) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (23:21:24) ±Current Players: Easten, Jinora, Micaiah, Veteran Padgett, Windblown, Xenon.
    (23:21:24) ±Current Team: Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager
    (23:21:24) ±Time: Day 3
    (23:21:24) You have 45 seconds to debate who are the bad guys! :
    (23:21:24) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:21:27) Micaiah: ...
    (23:21:30) Xenon: nevermind
    (23:21:30) Windblown: ok...
    (23:21:31) Veteran Padgett: lol
    (23:21:32) Xenon: padgett wouldn't miss a kill
    (23:21:33) Jinora: oh
    (23:21:35) Windblown: I mean we're not going to lynch anyways
    (23:21:35) Crobat: applause
    (23:21:36) Jinora: we are at 6
    (23:21:41) Easten: ,
    (23:21:45) Xenon: neither would windblown
    (23:21:46) Easten: ....
    (23:21:47) Xenon: or me
    (23:21:53) Xenon: so it must be
    (23:21:56) Xenon: Easten/Micaiah
    (23:22:00) Micaiah: yes
    (23:22:03) Jinora: why not vet
    (23:22:06) Jinora: xenon/vet scumteam
    (23:22:06) Micaiah: I would stall
    (23:22:09) Easten: ...
    (23:22:09) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:22:09) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (23:22:09) ±Current Players: Easten, Jinora, Micaiah, Veteran Padgett, Windblown, Xenon.
    (23:22:09) ±Current Team: Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager
    (23:22:09) ±Time: Day 3
    (23:22:09) It's time to vote someone off, type /Vote [name], you only have 30 seconds! :
    (23:22:09) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:22:09) Windblown: I would stall
    (23:22:19) Xenon: easten then
    (23:22:22) Batman logged out.
    (23:22:29) Batman joined the channel.
    (23:22:30) ±Game: Easten voted for Windblown!
    (23:22:32) Micaiah: whoever gets votes ties vite
    (23:22:33) Windblown: oh shit
    (23:22:34) Xenon: voting at 6
    (23:22:34) ±Game: Windblown voted for Easten!
    (23:22:37) Windblown: ok no vote
    (23:22:37) Windblown: thanks
    (23:22:42) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:22:42) Times Up! :
    (23:22:42) No one was voted off!:
    (23:22:42) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:22:42) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (23:22:42) ±Current Players: Easten, Jinora, Micaiah, Veteran Padgett, Windblown, Xenon.
    (23:22:42) ±Current Team: Villager, Villager, Villager, Villager
    (23:22:42) ±Time: Night 4
    (23:22:42) Make your moves, you only have 20 seconds! :
    (23:22:42) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:22:55) Xenon: I think it's easten
    (23:23:02) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:23:02) Times Up! :
    (23:23:02) ±Game: You were killed during the night!
    (23:23:02) ±Kill: Windblown (Villager) died!
    (23:23:02) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:23:02) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (23:23:02) ±Current Players: Easten, Jinora, Micaiah, Veteran Padgett, Xenon.
    (23:23:02) ±Time: Day 4
    (23:23:02) You have 45 seconds to debate who are the bad guys! :
    (23:23:02) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:23:03) Windblown: only town would be dumb enough to push a vote then
    (23:23:05) Windblown: oops
    (23:23:07) Xenon: rip
    (23:23:12) Micaiah: ok
    (23:23:18) Jinora: still think it's xenon
    (23:23:24) Micaiah: FOR WINDBLWN
    (23:23:47) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:23:47) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (23:23:47) ±Current Players: Easten, Jinora, Micaiah, Veteran Padgett, Xenon.
    (23:23:47) ±Time: Day 4
    (23:23:47) It's time to vote someone off, type /Vote [name], you only have 30 seconds! :
    (23:23:47) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:23:48) Xenon: eastern/jinora
    (23:23:50) Xenon left the channel.
    (23:23:53) ±Game: Jinora voted for Xenon!
    (23:23:53) Xenon joined the channel.
    (23:23:54) ±Game: Veteran Padgett voted for Xenon!
    (23:23:55) Xenon: shit I crashed
    (23:23:57) Xenon: what did I miss
    (23:23:59) Jinora: what happened to micaiah/eastern
    (23:24:01) WilsonA021s joined the channel.
    (23:24:04) Jinora: switching targets
    (23:24:04) Xenon: who do I vote now I can't see
    (23:24:06) ±Game: Micaiah voted for Jinora!
    (23:24:08) ±Game: Xenon voted for Jinora!
    (23:24:10) Micaiah: I think
    (23:24:11) Xenon: ok then
    (23:24:12) Sakuya Izayoi joined the channel.
    (23:24:13) Jinora: easten vote xenon
    (23:24:14) Easten: lag
    (23:24:17) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:24:17) Times Up! :
    (23:24:17) No one was voted off!:
    (23:24:17) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:24:17) ±Current Roles: Mafia, Mafia, Villager, Villager, Villager.
    (23:24:17) ±Current Players: Easten, Jinora, Micaiah, Veteran Padgett, Xenon.
    (23:24:17) ±Time: Night 5
    (23:24:17) Make your moves, you only have 20 seconds! :
    (23:24:17) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:24:19) Crobat: oh shit, gg
    (23:24:20) Jinora: gg
    (23:24:20) Micaiah: ...
    (23:24:21) Xenon: welp
    (23:24:22) Xenon: gg
    (23:24:34) Micaiah: I blame lag
    (23:24:36) Xenon: yes
    (23:24:37) ***************************************************************************************
    (23:24:37) Times Up! :
    (23:24:37) ±Kill: Micaiah (Villager) died!
    (23:24:37) ±Game: The Mafia (Veteran Padgett and Easten) wins!
    (23:24:37) ±Game: The Village (Jinora and Xenon) lose!
    (23:24:37) ***************************************************************************************
    Mafia had pretty easy mislynches - "I'm not mafia cause I would have killed alphabetically" - seriously?

    For all parties interested, this is known as WIFOM (Wine in Front of Me), taken from The Princess Bride. Can't be bothered to give the textbook definition but it's basically trying to make an argument based on "I'm not mafia, I wouldn't do x" or "they're mafia, they would've done y" which is bullshit. Sadly I knew Xenon was probably town but it was easy for mafia to jump on that (and then some random counter wtf)
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2014
  19. Roild

    Roild Member

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  20. Fegelein

    Fegelein The Mechanic

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    I don't like the sound of this.

    Evidentially you don't have a grasp on the reasons why those themes were deleted and this one remains. Vepix and Castle were removed because they were killing frenzies that required no skill to play other than faster typing skills. On the contrary, Vanilla encourages methodical thinking for both the Mafia and Village sides (who to lynch, which players are problematic, less incriminating kills etc).

    And it is quite easy to evaluate who is who with basic to intermediate perceptional skills.

    Except there is far more time to think things through and not simply throwing kills around.

    Which again refers to my point about perception and methodical play. It's not Vanilla's fault that the players are unable to play it, it's the players fault that they are unable to play the theme properly. There was no chance Vepix or Castle were going to undergo a substantial increase in skill, while this theme has much potential depending on the players in the game.

    You clearly don't understand, so let me help you.

    Mafia is generally known as a game of perception, at least in the party game format. The entire point is to be making educated guesses, and Vanilla experiments with Village's strength in numbers, at the cost of the assistance of Power Roles. There's a possibility that either side can win the game with luck, but you're far more likely to win Vanilla if you play intelligently, which is more than I can say for pretty much every other theme on PO at the moment.
     
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  21. Roild

    Roild Member

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    The game only seems rand-based if one is incapable of figuring out how to play Mafia. Vanilla theme is not about figuring out actions (who was distracted/inspected), it is about figuring out other players and analyzing other aspects of the game. I have absolutely nothing productive to say about relating Vanilla to Vepix/Castle. I will say that the things you believe about Vanilla are extremely wrong. Just because you can't find a way to do it doesn't mean it isn't possible, which it fully is. The overall experience will also suck if you convince others that the theme has no way to find Mafia other than to rand when it isn't true and will only create more unproductive plays and pointless rands later on. My point is to learn how to play Vanilla so others will know too then problem solved.
     
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  22. IceKirby

    IceKirby A.K.A. RiceKirby

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    It all depends on what you think 'skill' means in Mafia.
    A skilled mafia player is the one that inspects the right people? Or the one that can identify enemies and allies solely based on their behaviour? Which one of those is actually more rand-based?

    Remember, mafia is a game of social deduction. It's not about the role's actions, but the players interactions.

    Completely off-topic:
    Typing fast or slow in Vepix makes absolutely no difference. Daypix, on the other side...
     
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  23. NAVIDAD PIRATE

    NAVIDAD PIRATE THE PLEASURE OF BEING CUMMED INSIDE

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    [​IMG]

    also in vepix you could figure out who was who because literally everybody was vepix
     
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  24. Windblown

    Windblown sable knight

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    a playerbase that relies on PRs for the majority of its information will of course have a hard time transitioning to a theme completely devoid of them but it's not the theme's fault that they can't play

    god forbid vanilla asks you to think, as was the argument made in the first two pages of this theme (read Michu's posts they're excellent). my post up there where I tried to make a "guide" for vanilla shows how you can go very indepth in a simple game of vanilla (I did more commentary than the typical warstory)

    and I don't even think the time limit (seconds as opposed to days for forum mafia) is a problem because so many vanilla games would be won by the village if people learned to actually analyze actions and behavior
     
  25. Fegelein

    Fegelein The Mechanic

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    Isn't that the whole purpose of Mafia? Do you see Mafia purposely trying to act like Mafia in any other theme?

    @Rice: It was more a reference to Castle than Vepix, as I believe Castle to require more skill than Vepix.
     
  26. IceKirby

    IceKirby A.K.A. RiceKirby

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    If that's your point, then you cannot complain if someone is "ridiculously obvious scum" in any game. This is how Mafia is meant to be played everywhere in the world, it wouldn't make any sense if they didn't try to cover themselves.
     
  27. Joeypals!!

    Joeypals!! Don't you worry 'bout a thing~

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    OK, w/e, I'm just going to erase my posts because I had an idea only for everyone to scrutinize me on it.

    EDIT: Done, now leave me be.
     
  28. Veteran Padgett

    Veteran Padgett TFT Main Developer Developer

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    lol It just looks even worse now that Joeypals quotes suddenly pop out of nowhere.

    Anyways, since the general lack of scumhunting ability on the server has been mentioned, does anyone have any ideas on how to promote scumhunting on the server. We've already tried guides (kinda) and mafa tutoring, but people aren't taking the initiative to seek help. My thoughts are to bring up discussions in the deadchat about why you think certain people are mafia. Or if you were on a mafia team, try to get people to guess who your partners were.
     
  29. IceKirby

    IceKirby A.K.A. RiceKirby

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    "People disagree with me, gotta attack them and pretend nothing happened."
    If you are not willing to listen to counter-arguments, why even bother posting? Some exceptions aside, people took the discussion seriously, but then you accuse them of this and that only because your opinions differ?
     
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  30. Joeypals!!

    Joeypals!! Don't you worry 'bout a thing~

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    No, it's just that as far as I was concerned, I had an idea and people were like "Yeah, whatever, you're just the noob that's against Mafia as a whole and knows nothing", even if I know a bunch due to longevity, but I guess we have time to quarrel about this. Like I said, just leave me be, not in the mood to be torn apart for thinking different.