KARP KARP http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=2YSMwX1w (it works in JSON checker I promise) CODE: Spoiler Code (text): { "name": "Magikarp", "author": "<span style='color:#007A00'>MeowMix</span>", "summary": "Splash, splash, splash. The Magikarp just want to splash around, but the Gyarados are sick of all the tomfoolery and will attack any silly Magikarp who tries to splash them. The Fisherman just wants some lunch, so he fishes during the day. Can the Magikarp survive?", "sides": [ { "side": "village", "translation": "Magikarps", "winmsg": "Magikarps (~Players~) somehow defeated their evolved brethren. Nice job!" }, { "side": "mafia", "translation": "Gyarados", "winmsg": "Gyarados (~Players~) finally got rid of those annoying Magikarp. Some peace and quiet at last!" }, { "side": "fish", "translation": "Fisherman", "winmsg": "Fisherman (~Players~) caught quite a load today. Looks like a feast!" } ], "roles": [ { "role": "karp", "translation": "Magikarp", "side": "village", "help": "You are a Magikarp! You're generally pretty useless, but you can /splash someone at night. Try not to die!", "actions": { "night": { "splash": { "target": "AnyButSelf", "common": "Self", "priority": 1, "command": "distract" } }, "distract": { "mode": "ignore", "msg": "Someone tried to splash you last night. But nothing happened!" } } }, { "role": "bgyara", "translation": "Gyarados", "side": "mafia", "help": "You are a Gyarados! Always enraged, you can /kill someone at night. You and your Gyarados buddies each get your own kill. If anyone tries to splash or fish you, they die!", "actions": { "night": { "kill": { "target": "AnyButTeam", "common": "Self", "priority": 5, "broadcast": "team" } }, "distract": { "mode": "ChangeTarget", "hookermsg": "You tried to splash a Gyarados. It didn't end well.", "msg": "~Distracter~ tried to splash you last night. You killed it out of rage." }, "avoidHax": [ "kill" ], "startup": "team-reveal", "daykill": "revenge", "daykillrevengemsg": "A Gyarados is hooked onto the fishing line! ~Target~ pulls hard but is intimidated by Gyarados's fearsome stare." } }, { "role": "fisher", "translation": "Fisherman", "side": "fish", "help": " You are a Fisherman! Being human, your vote is more important than that of a fish: it's +2! Since you sleep away from the water, you cannot be killed at night. You can /fish during the day to catch your prey. Additionally, you may /net someone for a second catch, but be warned, you may be revealed. Watch out for Gyarados though; if you try to fish one of them, they'll kill you instead!.", "actions": { "standby": { "fish": { "target": "AnyButTeam", "limit": 1, "command": "kill", "msg": "Type /fish [name] now to catch your fish!", "killmsg": "~Target~ is hooked onto the fishing line. Fisherman pulls hard and successfully brings it to land where he battles it to the death!" }, "net": { "target": "AnyButTeam", "limit": 1, "command": "kill", "msg": "Type /net [name] also for more fish! Careful you don't reveal!", "killmsg": "Fisherman sees a fish swimming near the surface! ~Target~ was scooped up by a net!", "revealChance": 0.5, "revealmsg": "~Self~'s face was seen during the catch! This is why we don't get greedy." } }, "distract": { "mode": "ignore", "msg": "Someone tried to splash you last night. But nothing happened!" }, "vote": 2, "startup": "team-reveal" } } ], "roles1": [ "bgyara", "karp", "karp", "karp", "karp", "karp", "karp", "bgyara", "karp", "karp", "karp", "fisher", "karp", "karp", "karp", "bgyara", "karp", "karp", "karp", "karp", "bgyara", "karp", "karp", "karp", "bgyara", "karp", "karp", "karp", "bgyara", "karp", "karp", "karp", "bgyara", "karp", "karp" ], "killmsg": "±Feebas: ~Player~ (~Role~) fainted.", "killusermsg": "You fainted!" } [/HIDE] ROLES: Spoiler Magikarp: Technically a distractor, but it's really just a villy that dies if it happens to splash a Gyarados. Gyarados: General mafia. Revenges splashes from Karps and daykills from the Fisherman. Fisherman: Neutral sided daykiller. Has a second daykill that may reveal.[/HIDE] So this is Magikarp, possibly my favourite "gimmick" theme out of all of the ones I've ever played. Magikarps make up the village, and Gyarados make up the mafia. There are no power roles in this game, which means no reliance on an inspector to do all the work; every single villager has the same role. For the village, winning relies on the Magikarp being able to communicate effectively. For mafia, it obviously requires smart counterplay to attempt to blend in as a Karp as well as they possibly can. The Fisherman adds an x-factor, and is considerably powerful enough to win in a game where there are only two other sides. And that's really about it. It's an incredibly simple theme that actually requires some strategy to win from any side. EDITS: Fixed up grammar and flavour. Increased Fisherman's reveal chance on second daykill. Put all Gyarados on the same team (they weren't and I thought they were, strong reading) Reduced Fisherman's vote to 2. Reduced roles from 68 to 40. Removed Red Gyarados and Shiny Magikarp. Removed Gyarados daykill revenge reveal. Pushed back second Gyara's spawn by 1 Removed unused "rgyara" and "skarp" Removed karps; now 3 between each gyara instead of 4 Reduced roles to 35 Removed an accidental extra daykill for fisherman and his NK immunity
I know you did not code this theme but there are a lot of things that are not needed. Like avoidhax. I don't see anything wrong with this code wise but I don't see this being fun unless you are gyarados. Gyarados can't be killed unless red gyarados is in the game. I really can't critique it though because it is a sound theme with no problems. This is going to come down to the opinion of the QC.
I always liked this theme (yes, I'm fan of gimmicky ones lol) Also, I don't see necessary changes, new roles etc, since I like this theme as it was when we played it. Hope this'll be approved.
This theme promotes teamwork! Karp, Karp! Well, kind of, anyway. I like the fact that the Magikarp's splash is distract (wee) and Gyarados smashes the Magikarps if they splash him. Wee. This is like Vanilla vs Mafia theme, just that with teamwork. You don't really need to rand, because randing will only be making things harder. For you, for me, for everyone.
Knowing QC, this will never be approved; then again, Space Invaders has 3 roles as well. I haven't played this much, but I can see it's fairly well done, especially for a gimmick theme. It retains that ineffable "mafia" feel which QC wants so desperately, while putting a spin on the standard formula by stripping it down to its most basic constituents. Really isn't much to say about the code itself since it's so simple. The flavour text is weird in some areas though. Recommended Fixes (in bold) If you can address those minor errors, approved.
Hi Meow!! I miss this theme a lot!!! I appreciate the simplicity of this theme and the way it is coded to "clean" people, making communication and lying skills really useful! :D These are the main issues I have noticed: Spoiler - Gyarados have team-reveal. Red Gyarados doesn't. Gyarados can easily pm the Red Gyarados to connect. The purpose of not giving team-reveal to Red Gyarados goes to space. - Giving at least 3 nightkills to Gyarados team when Red Gyarados comes to the game makes the Magikarps too UP. Maybe if you made Red Gyarados share with team the first and giving to it a second separated nightkill (every other night... or not) may solve this problem. - Fisherman's info say that /net is a second daykill, but it should say that it can be used twice too, making it second and third daykill. - 3 votes, 3 (or 2) daykills, nightkill evasion and the possibility to be "cleaned" by a Magikarp that splashed him make the fisherman too OP!!! (I think that all the times I was fisherman on that theme I won.)[/HIDE]
Actually, Fisherman can only daykill twice, regardless of the command used, but /fish can only be used once per day. That happens because the "limit" attribute for standby actions is shared among all commands that daykill/expose/reveal. That's the same code used in Kirby's Meta Knight and Caterpie's Bug Catcher.
I'll give red gyara team reveal. as for the karp being UP, what I can do is simply make it appear a bit later. fisherman evading nightkills gives it a fighting chance at winning, since its a lone role and nightkills are always flying around; the extra votes give the village a way to find it if they have no better lynch targets (ie self vote for fisherman). I could reduce it to two to give it a bit less of an edge endgame
The theme is simple but still requires some strategy and I bet it will be fun in big games (: I think you should give Shiny Karp a reveal on the role and also a broadcast on the role. If you don't like this idea, then I think you should at least make Shiny Karps ignore team-kills. Otherwise, when a team-kill occurs between shiny karps, priority will not be always accurate!! And, I am not sure... but Fisherman's vote power bothers me, maybe 2 or 2.5 instead of 3? Anyways, it's better than before with the 33% reveal chance.
I'll reduce the fisherman's vote to 2 as for reveal on skarp, normally I would do it, but the game is never going to get large enough to the point where two skarp are present. tbh I should just curtail roles, but eh.
I feel this would be better with only two roles. I'm always a fan of simple themes with few roles and this is no exception. Still, I'm not sure about it yet.
Reduce it to 2.5: 2 may make him a bit UP, but 3 makes he win the game when there are he and 5 Karps alive after a night because of 2 daykills. Also, 2.5 is a way for it not to tie votes. And maybe make Shiny Magikarp expose its daykiller :)
I'd like to start out by saying this was my favorite theme of all time, albeit a gimmick theme. It's simple yet strategic, which makes it easy to learn and hard to master. The magikarps need to tell each other who they are splashing in case they die, but the gyarados can just kill them to frame the person they are splashing instead. Gyarados can also claim to be splashing each other, which would make it seem like they are "cleaned" to the magikarps. At the same time the fisherman should watch the splash claims and try to pick out someone being truthful to catch them and not die, and he also has the /net option if they are a more risky kind of player or if they need it in later rounds having only 2 votes. The fisherman also has a hard time pretending to splash being all alone, which should make them more suspicious to the observant magikarp. As far as I can remember it was pretty balanced too, although the gyarados seemed to rack up less wins than the other two sides (probably because they didn't fake splash each other, so that's a free tip to whoever reads this ;) ). I've never seen shiny magikarp or red gyarados in play so I don't know how they would work out. Anyways, if I were QC, I would approve this in a heartbeat. Since I also feel the need to at least contribute something other than my opinion, here is the roles1 numbered: Spoiler "roles1": [ 1"bgyara", 2"karp", 3"karp", 4"karp", 5"karp", 6"karp", 7"karp", 8"bgyara", 9"karp", 10"karp", 11"karp", 12"karp", 13"fisher", 14"karp", 15"karp", 16"karp", 17"karp", 18"bgyara", 19"karp", 20"karp", 21"karp", 22"karp", 23"skarp", 24"bgyara", 25"karp", 26"karp", 27"karp", 28"rgyara", 29"karp", 30"karp", 31 "karp", 32"karp", 33"bgyara", 34"karp", 35"karp", 36"karp", 37"karp", 38"bgyara", 39"karp", 40"karp", 41"karp", 42"karp", 43"bgyara", 44"karp", 45"karp", 46"karp", 47"karp", 48"rgyara", 49"karp", 50"karp", 51"karp", 52"karp", 53"bgyara", 54"skarp", 55"karp", 56"karp", 57"karp", 58"fisher", 59"bgyara", 60"karp", 61"karp", 62"karp", 63"skarp", 64"bgyara", 65"karp", 66"karp", 67"karp", 68"karp" ],[/HIDE] As you can see, there are 68 roles. I don't know if there's anything particularly wrong with that, but even at its fullest mafia usually doesn't pass 30 much. Anyways, love the theme, and have a nice bump.
santa claws I had entirely forgotten about this, so thanks :D I think I'll curtail "roles" to 40 other opinions on removing red gyara and shiny karp? I'm willing to go one way or the other
I guess removing both would be a pretty good idea. It would make the theme a bit more simple. I'd go for that. :) Another thing I think nobody had said: I guess Gyarados daykillrevengemsg shouldn't expose it... when fisherman kills it, 2 baddies go away: one is bombed the other will be obviously voted.
"help": " You are a Fisherman! Being human, your vote is more important than that of a fish: it's +3! Since you sleep away from the water, you cannot be killed at night. You can /fish during the day to catch your prey. Not to be rude, but I thought that was changed?
I changed the code but not the help message, good catch removing red gyara and skarp other thoughts on daykillrevengemessage on gyara?
Ohhhh yes, one of my favorites themes of all times! Anyway, on suggestions: - Fisher with only 2 votes is ok. - I think u can remove Red gyarados but get shiny magikarp in. It can be a nice addition because he don't know his partners (not like the R. gyara) and it adds fun. Well thats all, i hope this theme get approved ASAP! :D
I removed both we tested this and village is quite stronf in small games before the fisherman; only bad play from the village can really cause a loss. one option could be to code a weaker fisherman and bring him in in all early games. I also had a different idea where gyara still revenge kills karps, but also ignore the distracts and has the kill go through, which would rack up the kill total. thoughts on this?
I was in the playtests you mentioned and the first one to say small games aren't balanced. Even then, this theme is a lot of fun. Anyway, on to the small-game issue: A third side would fix this nicely, so I'd be all for a weaker fisherman. Maybe even bringing back the Red Gyarados in slightly less small games would be a fix. Racking up the kills... meh. It would -maybe- do the job, but it's still pretty situational. I'd recommend an early Fisherman of some sorts, as it keeps play interesting for all sides involved.
Making the Gyarados ignore distracts but still revenge kill would be counter productive, since it would be much more obvious when a Magikarp died from splashing them. My only suggestion would be to try and make Gyarados appear at a better ratio to Magikarp if they are UP. On another note, I also support a weakened Fisherman in smaller games. I'd give it only one kill and 1.5 votes. One last thing...in the main post the word Magikarp is in blue and the word Gyarados is in red, but in the game Magikarp are red and Gyarados are blue. OCD to the rescue.
fisherman with 1dk / 1vote / lower evasion chance in 5-12 player games will be coded in soonish or something. not going with 1.5 votes because too stronf in small/late game situations
If you don't give him 1.5 votes, then you will need to add something else or Fisherman will be unable to defeat Gyarados.
A part of why Gyarados seemed to be UP is due the fact they were killing just one karp per night (only one of the two Gyarados was making the kills), while they could kill 2, because they don't share kills. It happened on every tested game. BTW, the victory ratio was: Karps: 2/4 games Gyarados: 1/4 games Fisherman: 1/1 game I'd support that if I hadn't noticed what I've just said. I'd wait people to adapt to this theme and notice they don't share. If it happens Gyarados are still UP, go for this idea. With this said, for now, don't add the weakened Fisherman too. About the fisherman himself, I'd give him a lower reveal chance and keep the 2 votes; or keep the reveal chance and give him more 0.5 or 1 vote. You can wait if this is really needed for balance, though. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- After all said; the realized tests; how people (that had never played this theme) appreciated them; the possibilities you have to improve balance, if needed (and I know you'll do it); and, of course, the fantastic gimmickish way this game is played, I see no obstacle preventing me to approve [1] it. Let the wagon begin ;)
You know I did approve it already in the 5th post right? The count is at 3 now, counting mine, Li's, and Drapht's.
And mine Approve [4] I like this without daykills though If you want the one daykiller anyway, I'm not against it either, but he can very well get 2 free kills with this low reveal chance level in "net". I'd suggest that he got only two daykills, one of which at 50% reveal (or even more!). Remove the unused roles if you aren't planning on readding them. And don't be dumb, add yourself as an author for later updating
Looks fun but gyrados looks OP. WAY OP. Can not be killed, so can only be lynched, also revealing the fishermen AND revenging kills, they would have to be outnumbered by a LOT.
@Zeezix, I'll increase the second daykill reveal chance. also will remove unused roles as soon as I remember my pastebin password @KM007, if you look at roles, magikarp outnumbers gyara by a lot
Yeah, this is why you sort of need to test a theme before you can make accurate judgments about it. In fact, Magikarps are way OP and win most of the time because of their numbers.
I'll need to test before I can pass judgement. The only way to get information is to ram yourself on someone that can kill you outright. The Fisherman has little incentive to kill when he can just wait for everyone else to kill themselves. If anyone says the role evaded, then they are Gyarados and Fisherman is stuck getting lynched the following day. The theme sort of resembles minesweeper on paper, except Gyarados don't die when they get distracted. I know you said the game uses "I'm going on x, get them if i die", but that's one of the only ways to get information. What holds that back from being reliable, is if they distract another karp, no one distracts a gyara, then the gyara kills them. While this is "good play" it also comes down to a bunch of randing and attempting to learn who is mafia and who is not... It's "Vanilla with commands."
Diggin' this theme. Like a game of Vanilla only there's more emphasis on communication than anything. Magikarp have obviously a huge tendency to win given their huge numbers (if I'm not mistaken) but this could easily be remedied by either 1) decreasing their numbers or 2) increasing mafia numbers. I want to see this play tested <
Gotta say this theme emphasises the fact that sometimes you die as a hero I've given my opinions about it in some older posts, but I reckon I wasn't being conclusive by any means; henceforth I'm also suggesting a playtest session before I may give a final verdict.