[BW2 OU] When in Doubt, Gatr Out!

Discussion in 'Rate My Team' started by Dice, Aug 5, 2012.

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  1. Dice

    Dice Member

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    Last edited: Feb 24, 2015
  2. Clarion

    Clarion Snow on the Sahara

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    That GTA font~~

    Nice team format, so to speak.

    It would be interesting to place Volcarona somewhere in this team (unless some Genesects use Douse Drive-boosted Techno Blasts, which, however, loses out the speed), but replacing one member in your team with Volcarona might lose your team's strategy.

    Great team, nearly of the same epicness as your previously made Sandstorm team. :)
     
  3. The Dark Master

    The Dark Master Member

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    [​IMG]

    And why not try Dragon Dance? You can avoid being outsped and KOed by several threats, such as Modest Jolteon (If you put 152 EVs in speed). I know you don't get a bigger attack boost, but sometimes a bit of extra speed can be worth it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2012
  4. Emperor PPP

    Emperor PPP PKMNPurePower

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    Isn't superpower + Swords dance kinda counterproductive? Try brick break instead

    Terrakion has less

    EDIT: Alakazam looks like it could do a big chunk to this team, but that's mainly if it's running encore

    SubKyurem (the one that Ashton made) can beat this team as it can just stall out superpowers, another reason for brick break

    Nice team though
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2012
  5. Dice

    Dice Member

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    Quagsire is 2HKO'd after Hazards. Who uses Modest Jolteon and I lose so much power... no.

    Could we quit nitpicking what I wrote and actually just rate... SD + Superpower = enough power to muscle past steels like Ferrothorn and Brick Break is too weak.

    Celebi counters Alakazam...

    Ashton didn't make that Kyurem :x, and it's beaten by breaking Subs with Ice Beam and Focus Blasting on the Roosting with Toed, and you can SD next to up with Feraligatr as well as Whirlwind'ing out with Skarm if you have 50% health. :x
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2012
  6. Fegelein

    Fegelein The Mechanic

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    Gyarados is a better option IMO than Feraligatr, cause of Moxie and better attack and I think better speed.
     
  7. Dice

    Dice Member

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    Can Gyarados beat Ferrothorn without Intimidate and a really bulky Sub? No. Does Gyarados get Priority? No. Can Gyarados +2 in attack? No. Feraligatr and Gyarados are not comparable, really. Feraligatr has access to Torrent, Aqua Jet, and Swords Dance along with a fighting-type move, and Gyarados does not. Feraligatr also has no 4x Electric Weakness and a Weakness to Stealth Rock. Versus things like RotomW or Celebi I can take a Volt Switch / Giga Drain, SD up, and sweep with hazards. Just try it :x
     
  8. Fegelein

    Fegelein The Mechanic

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    If you really want to run Gatr though, I'd use DD because Gatr is somewhat slow. And maybe instead of Aqua Jet, Crunch to hit Jellicent? I know +2 does more damage, but still, Speed > Power.
    Also, why Mystic Water?
     
  9. The Dark Master

    The Dark Master Member

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    The most common one is 252+ defense and 252 HP (http://stats.pokemon-online.eu/Wifi OU/195.html) And that's left with 271 HP (394-[[394/4]+[394/16]]) after 3 layers of spikes and SR. Using http://pokemon.marriland.com/damage.php to work out damage, that's a 3HKO. It can alternate between Scald and Recover to keep it's HP up and eventually burn you, then KO you as you slowly lose your HP while it stays at or near full.
     
  10. The Dark Master

    The Dark Master Member

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    Mystic Water boosts your two most used moves and doesn't give you recoil from Life Orb. Also, "The most common Rotom-W set is Specs" Check the usage stats. These are the most used items:
    1 | Choice Scarf | 42.43 %
    2 | Leftovers | 34.48 %
    3 | Choice Specs | 11.31 %
    4 | Chesto Berry | 4.18 %
    5 | Life Orb | 2.34 %

    That's nearly 4 times as many Scarfs as specs; only 1/9 carry Specs.
     
  11. Fegelein

    Fegelein The Mechanic

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    Really, I though scarf was third? May have been Smogon Stats or something?
    Also, 200 posts.
     
  12. two sides of one coin

    two sides of one coin sick of all her shit

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    Gyarados is a completely different Pokémon and would do a completely different role. And that's Feraligatr's definitive set, so no changing it.
    On the ratee it's a nice little team Dice.
    The one issue I have with it it Toed's Speed EV's. Nobody runs 0 Speed Nite. Not even Phazingnite would run 0, they'd use 4 or even speed creep.
    So maybe'd you'd be better off investing in bulk.
     
  13. Dice

    Dice Member

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    Okay, let's get this straight: Feraligatr and Gyarados are two different Pokemon. Feraligatr has Aqua Jet and Swords Dance, making it a Swords Dance sweeper. Moxie is not comparable to Swords Dance since you have to kill a Pokemon to get the boost, and Dragon Dance doesn't provide the immediate power that Swords Dance provides. Quagsire is not a counter.. Aqua Jet lets me revenge kill thinks like Volcarona and Terrakion, Gyarados cannot do that. Torrent is not situational, I make it a point to attempt to activate it. A Celebi Giga Drain'ing activates it, a Scarf Haxorus activates it.. etc. Even if its not activated I can still wreck with the set. Idiotic theorymon is redundant considering Feraligatr helped me get #1 and Marth #1, which obviously proves its a formidable sweeper 9.9 Also bs damage calcs don't really prove much.
     
  14. The Dark Master

    The Dark Master Member

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    They can show that Physically defensive Quagsire (which most are) can beat it without crits, alternating between Scald and Recover (throwing in extra recovers when necessary) until you are burned; the chance of a burn from Scald (30%) is much greater than that of a Crit (6.25%). The chances are Scald will have burned long before any crit happens, and with no recovery Gatr's gonna be in trouble. There is only one thing stopping Quagsire... 1.61% of teams use it. But when you see one, good luck.
     
  15. two sides of one coin

    two sides of one coin sick of all her shit

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    Yeah but he could just switch to Celebi...
    This discussion is stupid.
    Are those calcs even with rain?
     
  16. The Dark Master

    The Dark Master Member

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    Oh yea forgot rain. But he may not want to switch after setting up as they may not get another chance.
     
  17. Dice

    Dice Member

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    Could you quit posting pointless posts? It's just an RMT, ffs.
     
  18. Gimmick

    Gimmick slowking2hipster

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    Helo0o0oo0o0o0 bri I love that Water Gem Politoed as I said before. Overall, this team is fantastic, but TOXI FUCKING CROAK can check that Gatr too ;]


    Also, Since Skarmory is specially defensive, it takes a whallop from Techniloom's +2 Mach Punch (assuming LO Adamant). With prior damage from Tornadus-T's Hurricane or Focus Blast, your only reliable check succumbs to Celebi, which basically can't touch it. Perish Song will eventually force it to switch out and maybe rack up some more hazard damage later, but it's still not a solid answer. Playing around such a Breloom seems to be a bit of a problem as it outspeeds Politoed, Feraligatr, Donphan, and Skarmory, easily putting one to sleep and setting up a SD. It can then proceed to OHKO every Pokemon on your team (barring Celebi and Skarmory). Obviously, you could play around it, making sure Skarmory takes no prior damage as well as sleep foddering a differnet Pokemon, but that puts more stress on the rest of your team. I noticed you supplied just enough EVs on Celebi to outspeed Adamant Breloom by 1, but all it can really do, as stated before, is Perish Song (or U-Turn/Giga Drain for some damage). To help with this, I'd recommend using Psychic over your choice. I can see it being used over Giga Drain as a different STAB, but I obviously don't know what fits the team best. It still continues to check Keldeo (but now it also checks Thundurus-T!) while creating a solid worry-free check to Breloom.

    Other than that, the team looks great and congrats on #1! Also those titles look hawt :]
     
  19. Dice

    Dice Member

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    Actually, yah. That's a really good idea. I'll just replace U-turn and throw on Psychic, it lets me hit Amoonguss too! I'll also run Taunt on Skarmory to set-up on Ferrothorn easier with this change, thanks.
     
  20. Razza

    Razza New Member

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    Not quite sure about your logic here, the fact that you and marth reached number 1 alone does not prove feraligatr is a formidable sweeper, a number of factors could have contributed to that, luck, team matchup etc, its no great secret that the ladder doesnt have particularly high standards of play, and even barring that you could have used an alternate sweeper such as gyrados to achieve similar results, but thats just me being fussy, ill just take your word for it that feraligatr is a good sweeper.

    Nice team too :)
     
  21. Zomaldape

    Zomaldape Now Known as "Raiju-R"

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    That feraligatr is like freaking choice banded azulmaril when in torret range along with mystic water and with +2!
    I wouldn't really say celebi is the sure fire counter to rotom-W simply because some of them carry signal beam(like mine rotom-w) I find lanturn to be the best counter to rotom-w.
    I really like the sets the team uses as they are probably the best sets t use for this current metagame, especially more specially defensive skarmory. I also like the politoed you have there as its somewhat of a Anti-defensive politoed lead and it even rivals Specs toed in terms of Hydro pumps Power
    Proof?(im using latios as its a common switch in to toed)
    252 Sp Attk water gem Politoed(+sp atk) Hydro Pump vs 4 HP/0Spdef Latios:57.28%-67.55% 2 hits to KO[/HIDE]
    A choice specs Toed's Hydro pump on latios
    252 Spe Atk Choice Specs Politoed(+Sp atk) Hydro pump vs 0Hp/SpDef Latios 57.48%-67.77% 2 hits to KO[/HIDE]
    Its a little behind specs toed but its almost near the same damage
    As for suggestions I can't really find anything else for you that might be better as you explained very well why you are using these moves on these pokemon but head smash on donphan is a bit odd I somewhat think ice shard would be better but head smash can OHKO all the genies(except landorus and landorus-t) plus volcroana.
    Overall great team Bri Keep up the laddering and team building
     
  22. Gtfo

    Gtfo blinded

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    Keep in mind that water gem only works once and for water type moves, so you will have the same power for just one Hydro Pump/Surf.
     
  23. Zomaldape

    Zomaldape Now Known as "Raiju-R"

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    I know that but most would be Opt to use Hydro pump most of the time due to its high base power and how deadly it can be in rain(I know I would use hydro pump)
     
  24. Nexus

    Nexus Legend Killer

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    Your team has no way to beat Ferro except Feraligatr superpower which is quite weak unboosted. Not to mention you have No switch in to Specs Latios and every time it comes in, there should be a kill. Also Really weak versus Lucario if Gets +2 and Donphan is below 70% Its gg. I could list many more but w/e.
     
  25. two sides of one coin

    two sides of one coin sick of all her shit

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    Just realised that in the importable it has Brave Bird on Skarm. ./nitpick
     
  26. Dice

    Dice Member

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    Ferrothorn is set-up on by Skarmory and I beat it with hazards... Specs Latios is countered by Celebi and Skarmory. If X is gone, Y sweeps, that applies to most teams.

    I point out that all your posts are terrible so you attempt to make my team look bad, and then you post another shitty post, wow!
     
  27. Dice

    Dice Member

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    o lol ty
     
  28. Nexus

    Nexus Legend Killer

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    >Celebi handles Latios. ooook

    Set up on? It sets up on all your pokemon

    X doesn't need to go. Ice punch koes it
     
  29. Gimmick

    Gimmick slowking2hipster

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    At +2 and with Mystic Water, Feraligatr's Aqua Jet is more powerful than Azumarill's. Also, Specs and Gems increase said move by 1.5x no matter what, so there's no need for calcs. They ARE the same, you simply forgot 4HP EVs on the 2nd calc, lol.
     
  30. Dice

    Dice Member

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    Your greentexting and logic are both rather disgusting.

    252SpAtk Choice Specs Latios (Neutral) Draco Meteor vs 252HP/220SpDef Leftovers Sturdy Skarmory (+SpDef): 47% - 56% (159 - 188 HP).
    252SpAtk Choice Specs Latios (Neutral) Surf vs 252HP/240SpDef Leftovers Celebi (+SpDef): 13% - 16% (56 - 67 HP). Guaranteed 8HKO.
    252SpAtk Choice Specs Latios (Neutral) Draco Meteor vs 252HP/240SpDef Leftovers Celebi (+SpDef): 61% - 72% (249 - 294 HP).

    Between Specially Defensive Skarm and Celebi to tank Draco Meteors and Surfs respectively, Latios is handled. Yes it is problematic as it required prediction on my part, however Skarmory isn't 2HKO'd by Draco Meteor and even Celebi only takes a maximum of ~72% from it.

    252Atk Life Orb Lucario (+Atk) Close Combat vs 248HP/176Def Leftovers Sturdy Donphan (+Def): 43% - 51% (166 - 198 HP). Guaranteed 3HKO.

    The way I play, I do not let Lucario set up. The team is offensive enough to prevent a +2, and if it somehow does, I can revenge kill with an Aqua Jet as it Extremespeeds or gets KO'd.

    You're posting because you don't like me, and it's disgusting, Please stop.

    Skarmory Taunt's Ferrothorn, Politoed can possibly 2HKO, and Feraligatr can dent it. I beat it with hazards, like I said. It's not hard, lol. After hazard's Jolteon can possibly 2HKO with Thunder, strong.

    I am not saying the proposed things are not threats, but your terrible logic and attitude is forcing me to explain everything .
     
  31. Emperor PPP

    Emperor PPP PKMNPurePower

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    Well any Alakazam carrying encore (Which is pretty common nowadays) says different

    I'm not sure if there's even a point in saying this since you're badmouthing everyone who posts on this thread

    EDIT: No mean to offend, but it's kinda true
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2012
  32. Dice

    Dice Member

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    15 | Encore | 1.94 %

    I'm not badmouthing "anyone who posts", but people who are providing terrible logic just like the Encore Alakazam comment aren't getting the nicest comments from me back.. lol.

    Oh and people that say Feraligatr is garbo are definitely going to make me be nice to them.. ?
     
  33. Emperor PPP

    Emperor PPP PKMNPurePower

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    Touche
    It's like when people posted that overheat would be rain weakened on my Rayquaza...

    BTW, I'm not too sure about OU - but I know LU's usage stats haven't been updated in months

    How do you deal with LO Thundurus-T?

    Also I've just realised that 5 members of your team take SE damage from BoltBeam... and Jolteon won't like to take too many hits
     
  34. Dice

    Dice Member

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    Celebi is my Primary switch as it beats all Choice varients, and then I go to Jolteon to outspeed and KO.

    If push comes to shove I go to Feraligatr when Thundy is like ~50% and Aqua Jet.

    But then again, it has no counters. 9.9 ban thundy-t pls
     
  35. ZoroDark

    ZoroDark i know everything

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    Nice team, Dice!

    Feraligatr is an awesome poke, and he really shines in your team!
    Still, Special Attacking Dragons van be a pain to face, like MixMence.
    VoltTurn can be a pain too. Altough I know you like Jolteon, Choice Scarf Tornadus-T perfectly fits in your team. He is a great check for VoltTurn and gives you a little bit more speed and can revenge other slower choice Scarf pokes, like Salamence.
     
  36. Dragon.

    Dragon. Oh noes I lost my sarcasm

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    Good team


    Gatry and Gyara are different pokes people. :x I like this team lots, so gratz on #1 and srsly why is everyone posting bs rates o-o
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2012
  37. Dr. Fuji

    Dr. Fuji Active Member

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    probably already been mentioned but celebi does not have U-turn yet your description says it does.
     
  38. Dice

    Dice Member

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    t'was changed .
     
  39. Dragon.

    Dragon. Oh noes I lost my sarcasm

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    You messed up Skarm's description? Does it have Brave Bird or taunt?
     
  40. Dice

    Dice Member

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    i didnt update the descriptions after changing. it now has taunt 9.9
     
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