So, this seems like a really fun idea. I'm currently adding moves (some will be tricky/maybe impossible with just a mod file, but hey. will try.), if someone else feels like doing the species (use the XD ones of these, add alternate formes for each and their evos (for the name, use normal species name with -S added to the end), only give them the listed moves, add all the other info you can find and ask here if you're not sure about any). Hopefully I can get moves done before I vanish for a week on the 21st. Types could be an issue since we can't currently handle more than two per pokemon and we need things like Flying/Psychic/Shadow for Lugia's weaknesses/resistances to work correctly (or a custom type with combined Shadow+Flying, along with any others we need? Ugly hack but it should work). And not sure how 3rd gen will handle moves with different damage categories for the same type, but worst case we'll just make two versions of the shadow type I guess? Having someone who can host a testing server would also help a great deal, since my internet is laughably terrible. And if someone wants to arrange a little project in the art forum for shadow sprites that'd be nice. Lugia could do with a custom sprite, but I'm sure we can find one of those somewhere on the 'net. The others probably just need shadow auras? If no one else is helping I'll probably eventually get this done, but if people want it soonish.. help out!
I've been working on something like this myself. My problem is there is no way to do Shadow Sky or Shadow Half. Another obstacle I have to overcome is why the moves are crashing my client. I'm thinking I'm missing a file or two.
Actually so far as I know you can have 3 types in the types file - I'm no scripting expert but I think you can do it Also the problem with merging types... STAB
Shadow Moves have a type. The ???-type, the same type Curse was. That's not made-up, it's in Colosseum; it's in XD. Shadow moves are of ???-type. Not to mention their programming is identical. All you have to do is assign Shadow Moves to type 17, the ???-type.
What've you done so far exactly? Makes sense to avoid duplication of effort, if you've mostly done moves there's little sense in me doing more on that. Also, for shadow half, I thought perhaps.. using a Super Fang's special effect with target set to all, and giving it the recharge effect as well may work? Not sure at all, but worth trying? Shadow Sky is probably unimplementable without source changes though. Luckily it's pretty useless competitively.
Shadow Half halves all user's HP. Simply edit the move Heal Pulse. The move Heal Pulse heals your opponent's HP by 50%. Change it to negative and then it'll lower your opponent's HP by 50%. Add in 50% recoil to yourself. Then change it to hit everyone. That way, everyone's HP is halved. As for Shadow Sky, I had the same problem. I combined Hail and Sandstorm, so it should theoretically hit all Pokemon except Mamoswine's family. That's as close to "hitting all Pokemon but Shadow Pokemon" that I could get. I haven't tested if it works though.
Heal Pulse heals by a % of total HP, not current HP. Additionally, recoil is calculated as a % of the damage dealt, no? So you're going to get totally different damages with your implementation? Super Fang halves the target's HP, so would be a much more appropriate choice for a base move. Hail+Sandstorm.. Would that not deal more damage than you want, and deal different damage to Ice or Rock/Steel/Ground types, and still hurt Shadow Pokemon? I mean, probably the best you'll get without source changes, but maybe better leave it as unimplemented? And, do you already have full XD stuff as part of your mod? If no, do you intend to, and what're you missing? And do you have a server to test it on?
Hail and Sandstorm types are hardcoded. Additionally, there is no support for adding new weather with mods only.
Yes, I had XD stuff. I'm not really missing anything. Shadow Sky is just problematic, and I thought I had Shadow Half figured out. I'm currently trying to get my server running. With any luck, I will. But you can't just NOT have Shadow Sky. Shadow Pokemon only have four moves: what, just leave the ones that know it with only three? Maybe a substitute, but I can't imagine what. And why is there no support? That seems rather harsh.
I mean the weather is rather hardcoded and kind of difficult to parametrize, you would need to modify source to add new weather type.
Well I know one way, but it's rather crude. Any Pokemon that knows a move with the word "Shadow" in its name, with the exception of Shadow Ball, Shadow Claw, and Shadow Sneak, is a Shadow Pokemon.
Using english names hardcoded, with the likely addition of more shadow moves in future gens.. ew. workable maybe, but ew. and Curse type? What about Pokemon with Curse? Alternate possibilities: Make Shadow the 18th type, make pokemon with shadow type moves immune to shadow sky and resist shadow moves. Allow more than two types per pokemon, and have shadow as a type. Create a large number of "doubletypes" alongside the Shadow type. These doubletypes would have the attributes of their base type alongside the shadow type. I've tried to make it as few as possible, but to accommodate all the shadow pokemon which have (or who's evos have) two types we'll need nine more types, plus standard Shadow, plus Colosseum Shadow. Spoiler Flying Noctowl Skiploom Yanma Mantine Swablu Ledian Gligar Murkrow Delibird Skarmory Tropius Togetic Ledyba Natu Spearow Pidgeotto Beedrill Butterfree Dodrio Farfetch'd Altaria Scyther Swellow Salamence Lugia Zapdos Moltres Articuno Dragonite Water Quagsire Qwilfish Spheal Carvanha Seel Lapras Starmie Poliwrath Shellder Dark Sneasel Tyranitar Houndour Sableye Seedot Houndoom Psychic Meditite Metagross Baltoy Lunatone Solrock Exeggutor Bug Ariados Forretress Heracross Shuckle Spinarak Pineco Venomoth Paras Ground Piloswine Swinub Vibrava Numel Rhydon Grass Shroomish Roselia Weepinbell Rock Magcargo Steel Magneton [/HIDE]
@ETE: Moves I just altered the base power to double their power to avoid the type chart altogether. I'll upload a zip file later today with what I've done.
Ah. I think the most efficient way would be to add 17 new types, each a Shadow version of the regular type, but they would all look exactly like the real one. For example, Shadow Lugia would be Shadow-Psychic / Flying type. It would function exactly as normal, except it'd be resistant to Shadow-??? moves. For example, Shadow-Fire type read as "Fire", and the viewer would not know that it was actually a different type. It's function exactly the same except being resistant to Shadow-??? moves. And yes, there needs to be a Shadow-??? for ??? just like Shadow-Fire is for Fire. We can't have Struggle doing super-effective damage, now can we? I actually think I might add these types myself on my mod if you guys don't mind.
Crap I just realized that my idea completely messes STAB up EDIT: I'll do what I did with MissingNo. I'll make duplicate moves. i.e. a Fire Blast that is Shadow-Fire type. Shouldn't be too hard. It'd only be about 50 or so.
Doubling power does not handle Shadow 'mons resisting it. MysteryMan, that seems like a good plan. Could you compare Dragonexpert's shadow move implementations with your own and adopt any improvements?
I don't know if that's a good idea. My mod is pretty convoluted with a whole bunch of things tied together. It wouldn't be easy to untie it. But what I have done is made a prototype type chart. Ignore the custom types, those are ones I personally added. 0= Not effective 1= Not very effective 2= Effective 4= Super effective http://i46.tinypic.com/2ir7mll.png (You know what stinks? Younger when I played Colo and XD, not once did I ever realize how the Shadow moves' type effectiveness worked. Those games may have been a lot easier had I known :P )
Would not need to untie, just check your shadow move lines against his, see if it's done differently and figure out if one is correct over the other. And, that looks very cool. All the XD moves would use the Shadow-??? type, right? And the Colo Shadow moves would use standard ??? type? Also.. I know it'd be quite a lot of work, but it would be really good to rearrange the types so that the customs come after shadow types. That way a mod which wanted to adopt your shadow work without custom stuff would not had unnecessary types in the db. And it would be much less work now than once you've implemented all the shadow types to mons, plus more custom type mons.
But the other three types have already been applied. And I already have added moves and other forms of Pokemon. Honestly, I'm doing this for my mod; I'm happy to share, but you'll have to change the ID's yourself. (Like changing XD001 from 249:5 to 249:1 or changing Shadow Rush from 565 to 560 or changing Shadow-Fire from 30 to 27). It's not hard, but I'm not going to make ID's for a stand-alone XD mod AND my mod. I'll make the ones for my mod. You can edit it. I don't mean to be mean, but I can only handle so much. Basically, no, I won't rearrange the types, but there is nothing stopping you from doing it. (Btw, by the time you posted this, I had already assigned all the types. Ctrl+F might make things easier.) I get what you're saying, but types are just ONE facet of Shadow Pokemon that'd have to be changed. The forms and moves would be too, and I'm not changing all those IDs which have already been done. Yes, XD moves would be Shadow-??? type and Shadow Rush (Colo) would be ???-type. I'll give you a mod with just the Shadow stuff, but it'll require ID-changing. Sorry. EDIT: Btw, I think I got Shadow Half. I used Super Fang like you said, making it hit all opponents. I also added the effect of Recover, but I changed the sign to negative. So you and opponents lose 50%. Plus I added Blast Burn's recharge. I haven't tested it yet, but it should theoretically work.
No problem. I can probably speed things up a great deal with some find/replacing. And, for Shadow Half, it should also hit your ally (like EQ). Additionally, Recover heals by % of total HP rather than % of current.. I'm not sure if there's a way around this though. Super Fang seems to be the only move which halves current HP, so unless you can make it target self then 50% damage to self may be the best option.
I looked it up on Bulbapedia. They said Recover healed based on current HP. And no, you can't make it target yourself.
To edit the target, you use the range.txt file. 7 is yourself. 10 is every Pokemon on the field. I'm fairly certain that you'd use 10 for Shadow Half and Shadow Sky.
Bulbapedia was wrong and I have corrected it. The only site you can rely on to have accurate effect descriptions is UPC: http://www.upokecenter.com/dex/?lang=en&move=105 though smogon and all other sane sources disagree with bulbapedia, including PO's source.
Well like you said, it's probably as close as we're gonna get. Btw, I have sprites for all the Shadow Pokemon in my mod, but I also have Hyper / Reverse form sprites. I have no intention of ever using them (programming way too complex), but if someone else is interested you can have the sprites.
hm, unless a dev takes a shine to adding it I won't have a use for them, but if you feel like uploading them somewhere in case that would be good.
So good news. I did what I said, and it seems to be working fine. There's a few bugs (some of the moves don't show up), but I'm pretty sure it's human error, so I should be able to fix it. One thing to note, however, PO forced me to name the new types different names. It wouldn't work with the same name. So I simply put "S-" in front of the types. S-Normal, S-Fire, etc. However, since all of the images are still identical, it's a very minor thing. Shadow Shroomish use Shadow Blitz on Conkeldurr. It's super effective! XD001 is going to be soooo Uber
Thanks coyotte. I used Greek letters. Sprites of Shadow Pokemon plus Hyper / Reverse Forms: http://www.sendspace.com/file/np1kw8 Complete Shadow Pokemon Mod: http://www.sendspace.com/file/q50zxc I even took the liberty of fixing the index numbers. It's not perfect. You might find human error in there somewhere, but I didn't. I do have to say though that Shadow Half and Shadow Sky don't work. Shadow Half is just... off. Shadow Sky just makes it Hail. Feel free to edit it to your choosing. Coyotte, would you consider perhaps scripting Shadow Half and Shadow Sky for us? Please? Or perhaps delegating it to someone else with the know-how?
Wait so after all the work I did to get the rest of it I have to source through all the source files to get just the two moves? That hardly seems fair. Whoever makes the two moves will have to upload it to someone else, so I don't think its too much to ask
If you want to compile the source yourself and incorporate Shadow Sky and Shadow Half into it, no one is stopping you.
Um... logic is. I can't make those moves. I need someone else to. Now I've made the rest of the Shadow stuff. It's not perfect, but the least I could get in return would be the two moves without having to sift through a bunch of stuff I do not need nor want nor probably understand.
All the shadow moves sans Shadow Rush are set to type 38, which is nonexistent and makes them unusable. Shadow Rush is instead set to type ??? which has normal effectiveness against everything. I fixed this by changing all the shadow moves to type 15 (???) and making the ???-type hit everything for super-effective damage. This doesn't really influence anything else because Curse is now a Ghost-type move, and there are no other ???-type attacking moves. However, this comes with a side effect: If a Pokemon has a secondary typing, it will be hit for 4x effective damage. Likewise, if a Shadow Pokemon with a secondary type is hit by a Shadow move, it will deal neutral damage. Can this be fixed?