[BW2] BW2 OU Potential Suspects Thread

Discussion in 'Past Gens Discussion' started by IFM, Jul 13, 2012.

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  1. pokemonnerd

    pokemonnerd Only uso listens to pnerd. Devo too. Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    He's trying to say that spinning in OU is actually hard as fuck, because if it were easy Deoxys-D and S would still be here.

    I just like how, in every kyurem-B discussion, that kyurem always runs at least 5 moves at any given time and can avoid any possible damage or status ailments whenever it switches into something. I've always wondered why people have such hard times dealing with bulky wallbreakers in pretty much any tier. It's reminding me of LU and RU's "problem" with nidoqueen.
     
  2. Aurist

    Aurist I do not jump for joy. I frolic in doubt.

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    [SECRET]reminds me of the past few suspect discussions[/SECRET]

    but seriously you guys - Kyube isn't going to be suspected. It was only just recently suspected and deemed not borked. It really has too much difficulty with its terrible coverage, everything being faster than it and able to hit it with an SE attack, hazard weaks, prio weaks, etc, to be too much for OU to handle. Now most pokemon who have all of those things wouldn't even be an OU pokemon, but Kyube is good and usable in OU in spite of those things (and as we saw, was too much for UU to handle). Take what you can get, guys. I understand it must be suuuuuuuuper annoying to occasionally get chunks blown out of your team by ~ a cover legendary ~ but the fact of the matter is it's completely fine where it is and there are plenty other things in OU that you can actually use more reliably to blow chunks out of a team than Kyube. It's still good tho.
     
  3. Mario with lasers

    Mario with lasers Banned

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    "Terrible coverage"? This thing has a mixed BoltBeam combo with STAB on a move and 170 Atk on the other one to back it up. That alone automatically disqualifies it from being deemed "terrible coverage".
    Don't say that "everything" is faster because that's a huge overstatement. Heatran, Mamoswine, Dragonite, Rotom-W, Tyranitar, Politoed and pretty much every support mon in OU is slower.
    The suspect test was a complete mess for reasons that have already been stated. Not only did everyone have their eyes on Genesect, but Kyu-B's best sets weren't known back then.

    But whatever, if Smogon is going to test it so will PO, you can be sure about it.
     
  4. .Rawr!

    .Rawr! c(°3°)כ

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    This. So much.
    Pro-ban kyurem-b people acts like it have always the right move, the right Evs and the right item to defeat its counters. In the most of cases isn't like this:

    - Like pokemonnerd already said, using Life Orb on Kyu-b is totally stupid, its typing already makes him vulnerable to Stealth rocks and most priorities to add the recoil of LO to it.

    - While substitute seems like a good move on him, it still hard walled for his usual counters, also it adds more to its 4mss (see palkia62 post for it).
    Finally, Substitute is a good move in general, not only on Kyurem-B: Sub-Garchomp is equally threatening (still best typing and more speed), Sub-Terrakion other threat, Sub-Gyarados says hi too. See where im going?
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2013
  5. Maple Syrup

    Maple Syrup blessermans

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    Well actually the set I gave is straight from Smogon's guide to Weatherless Offense. http://www.smogon.com/smog/issue27/weatherless_offense You can find Kyurem-B under Hole Punchers and this is what they said:

    "Kyurem-B, once thought to be the worst suspect ever, is now one of the best Pokémon in the OU tier; it also happens to be insanely good on weatherless teams. The main reason for this is that it thrives versus literally every weather in the game. With a simple mixed set that has some HP investment (156 is the amount I personally prefer) and a Modest nature, Kyurem-B can rip apart all weather teams. Politoed and co. are felled by Fusion Bolt, while Venusaur and other Chlorophyll sweepers get murdered by Ice Beam. Earth Power deals with Heatran, Ninetales, Volcarona, and other sun Fire-types. You can go with Outrage or Draco Meteor for a power move or just use Roost to obtain even more staying power. Oh yeah, Kyurem-B is also insanely bulky! It can wall all Water-types not named Keldeo, Chlorophyll sweepers, and Electric- and Grass-type attackers, all the while remaining a legitimate offensive threat. That right there is a perfect Pokémon for an offensive team."

    However if you don't care about healing from Stealth Rock or Life Orb with Roost, using Substitute to avoid status (commonly found on stall teams), or being able to hit bulky waters (stall uses these) you can use this set that will never die to anything ever!

    Mixed Attacker Kyurem-B

    Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb
    Trait: Teravolt
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 Spd / 252 SAtk
    Mild Nature
    - Ice Beam
    - Outrage
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Earth Power

    You lose the BoltBeam coverage that will wreck a lot of useful stuff and you can't use Roost which this thing needs if it wants to not die quickly. However I do agree that this particular set can be quite devastating to many stall teams. Yet is stall the most used play style in this metagame? No definitely not, Kyurem-B gets checked by so many offensive threats that it doesn't have a reason to be banned. If this was a stall based Metagame then yes I think that we should be banning Kyurem-B but since this meta isn't stall heavy then Kyurem-B can't hurt us too much.

    Now Kyurem-B is quite a good pokemon and I do enjoy using it somewhat it just isn't broken enough. It is manageable and has many common checks in this meta. I do not think we should ban Kyurem-B.
     
  6. Dr. Doom

    Dr. Doom Long time hater of stall

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    Specially based mixed Kyurem-B is poor. Hydreigon and normal Kyurem run better special based mixed sets due to their better SAtk, and in the case of Hydra better movepool and speed. Kyurem-B's best sets are:

    Choice Band
    Physically based mix
    Roost + 3 Attacks
     
  7. two sides of one coin

    two sides of one coin sick of all her shit

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    Are you guys listening at all?


    Hydreigon cannot run a mixed set as well as Kyurem-B because it has to use Draco Meteor and Superpower, which allow it to be predicted round as you can only use these once before switching out. It makes the Substitute set inviable because due to these secondary effects Hydreigon is a hit-and-run Pokémon. Kyurem-B is not. Quit with the bad comparisons.
     
  8. george182

    george182 Active Member

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    Kyurem-B would love to have a set of Dracco Meteor, Superpower, Fireblast and Roost/Earthquake. Don't claim that Hydreigon 'having' to use them is a bad thing lol.
     
  9. two sides of one coin

    two sides of one coin sick of all her shit

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    I'm not going to debate whether it would like them or not (and it wouldn't btw) but the fact is that they handle differently. So comparing is stupid.
     
  10. pokemonnerd

    pokemonnerd Only uso listens to pnerd. Devo too. Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    Draco Meteor is what makes Hydreigon able to hit and run(plus it's not weak to hazards), while Superpower is something Kyurem-B dreams of having. I don't see how having Outrage is so much better since you have to stay locked in and can be revenged that much easier. That's ironically one of Kyurem-B's greatest failings, and part of why Kyurem-W is far superior; the fact that it can't just launch an extremely powerful attack and if it guesses wrong, switch out. It's limited to locking into Outrage or hope that it hits something for super effective damage with Fusion Bolt. 120 Special Attack is nice for coverage but compared to everything else whose main purpose is to attack things in the tier, 120 in either attacking stat can almost be considered average in BW.

    I don't really see how Kyurem's a pokemon you aim to keep in battle for a while either, since it has weaknesses that are commonly hit upon in OU and people always drastically oversell its bulk. Substitute is mainly used to tank one attack in order to be able to attack whatever switches in, or take advantage of poorly built Stall teams to grab an easy kill or two.

    I really hope the pro-ban side isn't assuming that I(or we, don't like speaking for other people) think Kyurem's a bad pokemon, because it's not by any stretch of the imagination. It's just severely underwhelming compared to the hype of its Attack stat.

    EDIT: I shouldn't say that it isn't a pokemon you keep out for a while, actually. It can use bulky sets to ward off some pokemon commonly used in Rain and Sun, but overall those are just really good sets. Not something that would push it over the edge.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2013
  11. Virizion

    Virizion ~ Taste the Rainbow ~

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    I hope this comment is relevant, however people aren't using Hydreigon properly. After the past week I've only seen two (2) out of about nine (9) Hydreigon's use Draco Meteor as a move, the rest stick to Outrage and Dragon Rush.

    Hydreigon is a fantastic mixed attacker with access to moves that everything else gets jealous of. Superpower, Dark Pulse and Draco Meteor all on one (1) Pokémon is certainly unique (even though Dark Pulse may not be as good, I guess it's still worth it).
     
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