[GSC] Usage Stats Rambling. Because I can, and because the GSC subforum is kinda dead.

Discussion in 'Past Gens Discussion' started by Jørgen, Dec 1, 2011.

  1. Jørgen

    Jørgen Sniper

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    I should be writing a paper write now, but screw it, I'll kill a little time by looking at the usage stats and just commenting on it.

    Your November GSC Usage Stats

    Now, my critique on the state of usage. First, total GSC matches are under 1000 for the first time since June. Just a couple months ago, there were over 3000 GSC matches. Of course, this could be because of the way some of the matches were clumped in the releases of some of these stats, but it looks like GSC playing is going way, way down. Play more, you fools (though my recent example isn't much of one to follow in this regard, I guess).

    EDIT: Only half the month's usage stats were available, so rambling about that is stricken out.

    Now, on to the actual Pokemon that are being used (a lot of these seem to be the work of maybe 1 or 2 people, but I'll address everyone as a collective because it's easier):

    Drumlax should run Rest more often. Rest-less is potent, but you really only get one shot with it. Also, for non-drum variants, for Christ's sake, USE DOUBLE-EDGE.

    Egg, I personally don't like it at #2, but I guess this isn't too bad.

    Zapdos at #3 is solid, and the Thunder/bolt split is back around 50/50. Which is nice, since Tbolt definitely has its defensive merits.

    Tyranitar should not be that high, nor should EQ be used that often on him. His STAB is ROCK, dammit.

    wtf is Machamp doing at 5?

    Starmie's okay, though it needs to use more Psychic if it's going to actually scare Cloy away and do its job against CurseChamp. Twave is a nice secondary function, but if it hinders its primary reason for existence, don't bother. Also, what is Reflect, chopped liver?

    Gengar's okay where it is, but there's too many noobs running Psychic and not enough people throwing out DPunch for the uber-popular Tyranitar. Adapt, people.

    Wak is too high, he'll win games with prediciton, but he's also prone to just wasting one of your teamslots due to his fragility. I like the sets though, but there's entirely too much Bonemerang and too little Fblast.

    Miltank at 9. That's aight.

    Cloy at 10. A tad low, but I'm partial. Sets are good, too, but it's kinda hard to mess up Cloyster.

    Jolteon. You don't belong there. Jolt Growthpass is good, but not bog standard good.

    Zam just needs to die. He shouldn't be OU at all, because he sucks, yet people insist on using him. You're not even using Encore, so why?

    Dnite is high, but Dnite is pretty cool. I'd let it slide if his top set weren't retarded.

    Bump. Raikou. UP. And RestTalkRoar is stupid on him. 60/40 Thunder Split. The craze is dead (probably has been for a while, but I haven't been keeping up as well as I aught have)

    Skarm. Bring this up too. It's awesome for not-losing against Drumlax.

    Vap is probably a bit low. Or maybe not, I just came around when it was starting to get hyped. I'm not too big a fan of it, but it's too big a threat to a lot of old standards to be sitting at #16, imo.

    Lix is low, but again, partial. A bit too many exploders for my liking, though. I like him as a late-game star on Spikes stalls, and RS is awesome when you've taken out their water via other means and only have their Skarm to go through. It's not that great for Zapdos, though, tbh.

    Suicune should not be 18. Jesus.

    Zard is too high.

    Forry is probably low, though I'm not a huge fan. Still, with Starmie (sans Reflect, no less!) and GD Egg being so common, you'd expect more Forry running around setting spikes and being nuisances.

    Bliss. Meh. Probably a bit low, tbh.

    Quag needs to run Drum.

    EQ RestTalk Hera is dumb. SToss or Curse, maybe Counter over ST. 3 attacks could also work in theory. And reversal is a cool gimmick, just explode on Zapdos and you're good to go.

    I can see that, below this, stuff just gets kinda dumb. Nidoking, Missy, Espeon, Muk, and Clefable definitely need more love. Though I can kinda see why the latter 4 are seeing lowered usage, what with all the Tyranitars floating around.



    Welp, I'm done stalling. I now have less than 6 hours to finish the paper I'm procrastinating on. Hooray.
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2011
  2. Lamperi

    Lamperi I see what you did there

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    I just want to comment on usage stats:

    No usage stats were collected between November 19th and November 30th. That reduces the battle count to roughly half. (because of error by staff)
     
  3. borat

    borat Member

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    Ranked stats is slightly more accurate with regards to usage, so use that: http://stats.pokemon-online.eu/GSC OU/ranked_stats.txt

    That said, most of the ranking is disagreeable past #3 for a general GSC thing.

    Snorlax - right
    Egg - about right
    Zapdos - about right
    Cloy - too high (all he has to offer is just spikes + explosion)
    TTar - slightly high
    Miltank - slightly high
    Gengar - about right/slightly high
    Raikou - too low (you serious? this should be your go-to special wall/spikes shuffle/talker/whatever)
    Nidoking - too high (he's no better than the other physical sweepers)
    Steelix - about right
    Misdreavus - slightly high
    Machamp - about right
    Skarmory - too low (learn gsc guys; snorlax FB at 10%? use skarm please)
    Starmie - about right
    Vaporeon - slightly low
    Jolteon - about right
    Marowak - about right
    Suicune - too low (learn gsc)
    Forretress - slightly low

    Snorlax @ 93% is much better than a "mere" 77%.

    Not enough SD lax. I think DE/BS/Return should be like 40/40/20.

    Giga Drain usage too high on Egg on grander scheme, but makes sense with high ttars.
     
  4. dhhaxmaster

    dhhaxmaster You've Been Haxed

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    Skarmory was created in 3rd gen. It shouldn't be able to be used in GSC. Unless I'm crazy and skarmory was made in GSC in my sleep.
    EDIT: Wow, I guess I was. I can never remember seeing a Skarmory last time I played both Silver and Crystal. Well, now I know.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2011
  5. Jørgen

    Jørgen Sniper

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    You've been asleep for a while
     
  6. Meteor64

    Meteor64 TM1337 Falcon Punch

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    You are indeed crazy. Skarmory has always been a staple of GSC. Its pokedex position should at least poit that out to you.
     
  7. suzaliscious

    suzaliscious Banned

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    ...

    It's Gen 2. I caught one in Crystal.
     
  8. DestinyUnknown

    DestinyUnknown Active Member

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    Lol, Suicune 8% and raikou only 25%

    Cannot believe at all, raikou should be at least 50% usage (2-4 place) and suicune in the top 9, for god's sake.

    Anyways borat, you are talking about December stats while jorgen used Novemeber stats. Both bad though
     
  9. Jørgen

    Jørgen Sniper

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    Yeah, we just got december stats, but they're already looking better than November's ranked stats (hopefully they stay that way).

    Miltank Ttar Starmie were 3 4 5, above Zappy and Raikou at 6 & 7. Also, Skarm and Cune were still wayyy too low. Other than that, I guess the ranked November stats weren't too shabby (Jolteon's too high, but whatever).

    I wouldn't call the meta "bad", since a large portion of the games is played by scrubs and not the long-retired old-timey guys that have the theory down-pat. It's not as all over the place as it could be, though it could be a lot better, as evidenced by the atrocities of the electrics', skarmory's, and suicune's positionings.
     
  10. Weavile

    Weavile Phoenix

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    This topic (y)

    Anyway. I agree, except I don't think Ttar is too high really (he's legit) except the EQ bit, that's weird. Skarm defo needs upping a whole lot. Suicune. I'm gonna use it...
     
  11. Jørgen

    Jørgen Sniper

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    I mean, make sure you're not just using things just for the sake of using them. They have to synergize with your team. You don't want to just slap Suicune on a team, either ruining your offense while giving yourself a very measley layer of defense against mixed sweepers, or giving your stall excessive redundancy against mixed sweepers without accounting for thing Y. Of course, the thing about Suicune is that there's so many GSC teams that can literally just slap Suicune in (the way I just said to be cautious not to do) and be legitimate, which is why its low usage is puzzling.

    Ttar is a wily one, I'll give you that. Without any true bulky waters (which you can easily go without on even a moderately offensive team), there's little actually in his way. However, hardcore stalls will wall him indefinitely with a combination of Suicune, Miltank, and whatever other random thing his set happens to be unable to touch (e.g., Raikou for EQ-less variants, or Starmie for variants without Crunch, or Snorlax for variants without DP). That's why I consider him more of a "counter offensive" Pokemon instead of a true "offensive" Pokemon. However, given the sheer number of Eggs, Cloys, and Gengars running around, and the low number of Cunes and Skarms out there, it looks like Explosion offense is at a high at the expense of the hardcore stalls, which would explain Ttar's high usage. However, generally speaking, Ttar isn't a #4 Pokemon.
     
  12. Weavile

    Weavile Phoenix

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    Yeah. I just meant I was gonna make a new team. Mine's pretty naff and getting a bit boring.
     
  13. borat

    borat Member

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    I know I'm talking about december, hence I never responded to him in particular, just the list.

    Raikou/Zapdos should both top 50% imo (both top 50% since it's perfectly reasonable to double up on Raikou/Zapdos). Start doing that btw, everyone. Play Zapdos + Raikou on the same team, you'd be surprised.

    Also, more people use this. I like it.

    http://wiki.pokemon-online.eu/view/Category:2nd_Gen_OU_Analyses
     
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2011
  14. Crystal_

    Crystal_ Active Member

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    While the usage stats seem decent, there are still some dumb things in the movesets. Most common Raikou doesn't rest, most common gar has hp dark (who the hll is using these things). More than half Starmies don't spin (stop using all out attacker and parafusion nonsenses guys, use spin. Or just don't use Starmie). Growl Miltank at 40%. Most common dnite set is surf ibeam tbolt fthrower no comment. Zard/Quag never drumming wtf. Muk with frustration +50%. Mirror Coat Suicune almost 50%, really?
     
  15. DestinyUnknown

    DestinyUnknown Active Member

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    I have battled a bit GSC today and I have seen Thunder Snorlax in 3 battles, wtf is that
     
  16. pokemonnerd

    pokemonnerd Only uso listens to pnerd. Devo too. Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    Probably people not knowing Steelix or Fire Blast exists. Plus your average ladder players tend to be idiots anyway.
     
  17. borat

    borat Member

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    Thunder hits cloyster harder than anything while still hitting skarm.

    MC cune isn't bad. Makes zap/kou matchups really awkward. Vap too.
     
  18. DestinyUnknown

    DestinyUnknown Active Member

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    But cloyster is still set up bait (if not carrying explosion) if you have rest, I still think Fire Blast is way better (and is more reliable due to accuracy) but w/e
     
  19. borat

    borat Member

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    I don't think thunder + curse/drum works. Thunder usually is paired with EQ/Surf and DE. Or that's how it was.
     
  20. Jørgen

    Jørgen Sniper

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    MC is good on Cune. Even if people see it coming, it keeps something like Snorlax from having to take the full brunt of Thunders. Probably not 50% usage-worthy, though, because it doesn't really give Suicune's team the reliable support that something like Toxic does, and doesn't really work too well on ST sets.

    Thunder probably wouldn't be great, but it could work on Curselax. Every Curselax is going to be walled by something anyway, and Thunder gives it the chance to beat most of the common things that stall could throw at it (kills Skarm, para's Missy and Gar, can let you luck Miltank and Umbreon with FPs). I guess it could work on Drumlax for the same reason, giving you the ability to instantly threaten Skarm and spread paralysis while freeing up your STAB for Frustration/DE instead of the weaker Bslam. Of course, it's still recommended you use Thunder mostly on Mixlax for Cloyster, because having Thunder just you can spam it for para is how you run out of Thunders and make that moveslot useless in the long run.
     
  21. M Dragon

    M Dragon Active Member

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    Actually MC cune is pretty interesting, especially when used with something that wants electrics out of the picture
     
  22. Jørgen

    Jørgen Sniper

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    Meh, that's the gimmick end of it though, you get one shot at that kind of thing, so 50% usage for that purpose is going to just ruin it.
     
  23. M Dragon

    M Dragon Active Member

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    ofc, it needs the surprise to work